fertilizer confusion
 

hello, I've spent too much time researching fert. I only have a few orchids; 2 paph., 2 phal. I've read the recommendations given by the growers and they recommend 20-20-20. When I shop for fert. for orchids specifically, it's never 20-20-20. Last year and up to a couple of weeks ago; I used Dyna-Grow 1/4t. per gal. every time. The bottle sprang a leak so I threw it away thinking that I needed something else. All four of my orchids and my Streptocarpus are beautifully in bloom. Should I stick with the Dyna-Grow, it produced these blooms, or should I change. Please advise.

Fertilizer confusion - confusion? Sounds like you already understand fertilizers and the three major numbers associated with NPK.

I'm sure you will get many (varying) opinions to your question, and I'm sure those opinions are 'good-will' efforts to address the question you asked. It's ultimately up to you to make the choice (regardless of varying opinions). Personally, I lean toward the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" train of thought.

If the fertilizer you have been using works (and it sounds like that particular fertilizer brand is doing it's job with the way you are applying it), you could continue using the same brand/formulation because it has proven to work for you -or- you could certainly use something different (and observe for pros and cons).

If you can, please post some pictures of your blooms if possible. I think most of us enjoy/appreciate seeing pictures of orchids when flowering.

reply to post
 

Thanks for replying. As you say; if it isn't broke don't fix it. I'd like to post pics of my orchids but as a newbie to the Board I haven't found out as of yet how to do it.

To post photos... from the Quick Reply dialog box, click "Go Advanced". Scroll down a bit and you'll see "Manage Attachments". Click on that and another window will pop up. Browse to your picture and select it. When you have selected all the photos you want, click Upload. You'll see the files under Manage attachments. When you're done with writing your message, click Submit Reply as usual, and your photos will be in your post. One more little note... it's a "feature" of the software that sometimes photos show sideways in your post. The cure for that is to open the files in any photo editor before you upload them, make some little change and save... that seems to reset the orientation.

As for fertilizer... the major component that orchids actually utilize is Nitrogen, the phosphorus and potassium are needed much less. So base your choice on that. As for amount, you'll find lots of discussions on the Board on the fine points ... Read through them, ask questions... my personal bias is to keep it as simple as possible, the main take-away is that orchids don't need much at all, fertilizer is the least-important factor in orchid-growing... get temperature, light, watering, air circulation right, then get into the weeds with fertilizer. :)

Just a quick note about posting pictures, if you go to the first topic listed of "About this Board" on the homepage, and go to the first sticky topic called "tips for posting photos" you'll find some good advice there. The very last comment helped me start posting correctly oriented photos.

That's quite ok ------ and no problem. Because out in the wild ------ the orchids just have to take what they get, and it's highly likely that the fertiliser they get in the wild is not 20-20-20 as well.

But ---- whatever the N-P-K values are ------ we can just focus on the left-most number .... the 'N' value. And then go ahead with determining roughly how much fertiliser to add to a certain amount of water.

This just so happens to be discussed at this recent thread ----- link here.

Some fertilisers are in granule form. Some in liquid form. Some people have syringes for measuring the liquids. Some use scoops, or teaspoons, or they fill a portion of caps of bottle (such as quarter-cap etc).

Whichever method we use ----- the main thing is to have a fertilising system (schedule and concentration) that is beneficial to the orchid --- without over-dosing them, and maybe without under-dosing.

I'm not sure that for someone with four orchids and a newer member here, the thread you lead to will do anything more than cause confusion SouthPark. Just sayin', that one got more than a bit overly technical for the question originally asked.

I'm with wisdomseeker on this one.... your orchids are doing well, blooming, etc. Buy a new bottle of the Dyna and enjoy the blooms. Nothing broken, no need to reinvent the wheel. Fertilizer is way down the list of keeping an orchid alive and getting it to bloom. Sounds like you're already doing just fine.

WW - as the opening poster is using teaspoon and gallon ...... I can just provide this nice rule of thumb basic method that anybody can use :

For gallon of water ---- number of teaspoon of fertiliser to use is number of gallon TIMES 6, then divide by the "N" value.

So - for example, if N is 20, and we want to use half a gallon (ie. 0.5 gallon), then just do 0.5 TIMES 6, then divide by 20 to give 0.15 TEAspoon of fertiliser (to add to half a gallon of water).

But if say we want to use 1 gallon of water, then just do : 1 gallon TIMES 6, then divide by 20, resulting in 0.3 TEAspoon of fertiliser (to add to 1 gallon of water).

There's nothing to it at all. And if the N value really is 20. Then the calculation becomes super easy. In that case, we would just take the number of gallons and multiply by 0.3.

So, for 1 gallon of water to be used (eg. 0.5 gallon of water), we just do: 1 TIMES 0.3 ---- which gives 0.3 TEAspoon.

The above just assumes 6.25 gram per teaspoon.

And the 0.3 TEAspoon fertiliser (for 1 gallon of water) bumped down to 0.25 teaspoon per gallon is no problem at all.

I don't find that thread confusing at all. Just because someone is a new member and only has a couple of orchids doesn't mean they have been living under a rock before finding this place.

No offense.

The people here are very knowledgeable and will steer you in the correct direction. There is a lot of misinformation about growing orchids in your Google search results though.

Knowledge is power. Soak it up

One of my very early orchid mentors, a successful orchid grower over many years, was asked "What kind of fertilizer do you use?" His reply, "Whatever is on sale." He also successfully grew Vandas in a shady area of his yard. (Against a wall, which provided some winter warmth... conclusion, protecting from cold probably more important than full sun) His plants didn't read the books, Google hadn't been invented yet. Common sense and observing one's plants goes a long way toward achieving success. Focus on the most important factors first. Indeed, what is not broken don't try to fix.

Bottom line, you are looking for a all around fertilizer, or that's what the culture sheet says.

So 20-20-20 = 12-12-12 = 8-8-8

The only difference is the dose, or how you dilute it. Get yourself an EC/TDS meter and you'll be able to KNOW how strong you are feeding it

Or just use 1/4 to 1/2 of whatever it says on the bottle. Too little is much better than too much.

That does work also. But there is no information for future reference when you do that.

Good analogy, feeding without knowing HOW much exactly is kinda like eating off the run down school bus taco truck. You may not get sick this time, but it's gonna happen eventually

I use 20.20.20 with Cats and Orchid Focus with the rest.

I normally have lots of flowers but I this is because of Roberta Comments: right conditions and supervision; Humidity and light

BTW In regards to fert, those anyone fertilize foliage with Orchid Focus? . I just realized that they suggest that every 3 day..

In nature, when does a plant just get "plain" water? Never

Roberta is right on weakly weekly. My ocd kicks in if I don't know exactly what's in there

Foliar feeding doesn't do much, if anything, for orchids... the leaves have a waxy cuticle (an adaptation that conserves water in their epiphytic environment). So fertilizer applied to the leaves just rolls off or washes off. Yes, some will then end up in the medium where the roots can absorb it (or maybe a tiny bit may get into the leaves). It is a lot more efficient to put the fertilizer on (and through) the medium where it goes straight to the roots in the first place.

Roberta, question. Have you ever wondered how much fertilizer your plant could take? If it's not nutrient burning it's still hungry right? The plant will store all this "energy" and use it how it sees fit. If you are giving her a heaping plate, and she eats it, roots will be better, leaves will be better.

You can only walk the thin line of making her fat and killing her with a TDS meter.

Orchids won't particularly "store" excess nutrients... they'll absorb the little bit that their roots are able to absorb and the rest just washes out. You can't force feed them. With other factors that might inspire faster growth (more light, perhaps a bit of extra warmth) they likely will benefit from more fertilizer. But the difference is going to be small - and all the factors need to be balanced. And not useful for all types. I am interested in happy-medium conditions that let me grow variety. Far more technical than I care to get... I'm not going after cultural awards.

And then you start injecting CO2 into the grow area. 😁 I'm really trying to recreate the mesozoic era in my garage lmao

A lot of truth in the above words.

Most scientists are quick to point out that observation is essential to science. The core skill of a scientist is observation (using their personal senses or using tools of the trade to do so). Usually, growing orchids requires some patience (which also applies to observation).

Many times an experienced orchid grower can pass information along that works and/or has worked for them, to hopefully make things easier for another ('been there, did that' scenario). And that truly does come from experience and "hands-on". Orchid hobbyists (without the trio of initials following their names) that truly observe their plants are like scientists too, eh?

For what it's worth... Andrew-L made a good point. Never judge a member by the number of posts (or the date of their membership)... The member with 2 posts or newest date might just blow everyone away with their knowledge.

The only time fertilizer gets confusing is when you are mixing them and trying to figure out what npk value you have when you mix an 6-4-4 with a 0-0.5-0.7 when using 1ml of the first and 2ml of the second per gallon of water

Andrew ---- good point. For 0:P:K cases ..... I think the main focus will then be choosing the concentration of P to be targeted for our mix. Eg. we choose in advance a suitable/safe final concentration for say "P" - such as 50 part per million or 0.005 percent --- then establish a simple formula to make a water-fertiliser mix that achieves approximately that particular target concentration of "P". Although - this sort of fertiliser doesn't have nitrogen, so wouldn't be a regular sort of fertiliser to use for orchids.

Thanks Andrew_L and SPark, for knowing all about how this orchid growing works. This has become a perfect storm. Over and out.

WW - it's likely that you looked at somebody else's post and assumed it was me that was posting - about how orchid growing works. I didn't mention anything about how orchid growing works.

I only provided a method for determining amount of required fertiliser based on knowing a couple of basic numbers --- amount of water we want to use, and the 'N' value on the packet of fertiliser.

In my case, the 6-4-4 is my general feeding and the 0-0.5-0.7 contains earthworm castings and bat guano.

I forgot to mention - that I added this basic rule of thumb calculation because it is straight-forward to apply.

And could be used as an alternative (if one wishes) to the other rules-of-thumb methods. It could also provide advantages over other rule-of-thumb methods. So basically just providing more choice.

Offering something nice and useful, and not being imposing (as in not 'you must do') - is pretty good.

Also - regarding dyna-gro ... if the amount that had been used was/is working well, then certainly ok to stay with that product and with the amount previously used - using it in the same way as was/is done.

And - if the old bottle sprang a leak - and if a new bottle does the same thing, then just pop the contents into a more substantially strong container (and put a label on the new container for safety etc).

True! If it isn't broken, then it isn't broken. There is nothing to fix heheh.

Thank you Roberta it makes sense and it what I always understood, but reeding the label ..I was like..ummmh

Then in a youtube video there is a cattleya nursery saying that it's better to spray ... nurseries splash water with fertilizer. Different method here and there makes you think 🤔

There certainly are some people out there that demonstrate application of fertiliser to leaves. I once did it, but tending to believe it's not actually effective - unless lots of serious lab study group workers all come together in the future to say otherwise.

At this video here - Top tips for orchid success | Indoor plants | Gardening Australia - YouTube

At approximately 7 mins and 5 seconds into the video, you can see the orchid getting a couple of sprays of fertiliser/water mix.

I tend to just go with the 'regular' way ------ applying fertiliser solution to media and/or roots.

I don’t find that confusing at all.

You end up with 3 ml of a 1/3 (6-4-4) + 2/3 (0-0.5-0.7), or 2-1.67-1.8 formula.

Of course you do realize that fertilizer formulas are weight percentages, not volume, so you’d really need to know the specific gravity of each to determine the exact formulation.

The periodic table is a good resource. There we go again with the SI units.:biggrin:

Alys's blooms
 

This is a test. I'm trying to follow the directions for sending photos. Attachment 151430

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Successful test, and cool macrame!

That worked excellently. And the photos are so beautiful!

I like the colours, feel/mood of this one. Relaxing and enjoying the beauty. Wonderful.