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AOS Membership.
By Waldorbigbill at 2006-12-22 15:02

I feel inspired to write this after Having Dinner with the new Vice Prez. of the AOS. We talked a lot about how Membership was down and how some things are changing at AOS. It sounds like they got a lot of great ideas to help raise membership and make AOS an even better society. I always love the magazine but hated the price. He told me about the cost that is involved in doing the two magazines and how they use the membership money for a lot of good causes. The support of the nonprofit membership organization through dues aids so many other important areas that the Society supports year round -- orchid research, conservation, education, Affiliated Societies, and the like.
His views on how to make things better for the orchid hobbyist really impressed me. We talked on topic such as judging and how we need to get the youth more involved in orchids.
Most people would think who cares about their membership being down. Well let me say that I'm not a member but after speaking to him I'm going to get a membership to help support AOS. Being that I'm part of a family orchid business that has been operated since 1925 we see how AOS makes a difference. It educates our costumers. Instead of just wanting a Phalor De. now they want to be come a hobbyist and collect better things in return the suppliers and grower have to look into improvement and grow only the best at all times. I guess you can call it the food chain. So I urge you all please go out get your Love ones a membership to AOS or send in a support check to them. This is coming from someone who is not a member but was touch by the future of AOS at one dinner.

36 comments | printer friendly version

by cb977 on Fri, 2006-12-22 15:19
I joined a few months ago and I love it! The Orchids magazine is full of very interesting articles...and of course there are gorgeous photos! Still waiting for my free plant, though It takes 8-12 weeks before that happens and it's just about at the end of that time frame. Guess I'll contact them...

for anybody even thinking they may want to join, just two words:
Do It!
You'll be glad you did

Thanks for the article, Bill
Merry Christmas and a safe, healthy Happy New Year!

by Ross on Fri, 2006-12-22 18:15
Not wanting to throw cold water on anyones opinion, I was a member of AOS for many years and the only thing I got was an expensive magazine with very technical articles that were rarely useful to me personally. I would want to see a discussion on EXACTLY what the dues goes for (besides salaries) as the advertizing in the back of the magazine generally pays for the printing. I still have a few issues from the 1990's and I just looked to see what volume of pages are advertizing in the back. A little over 1/2 the pages! During my years of membership I wrote to AOS several times for help with plant ID and got no response! Zero. I would gladly join again if 1) the Society would advertize what my dues are going for, 2) articles of more general appeal (rather than scientific articles from someone who explored some jungle and tried to classify some plant), and lastly, I would hope the Society would consider a structured dues schedule that gives consideration to prospective members who live in remote areas where there are no other orchid hobbyists or no local chapter. Just my 2 cents. I really hope those that join get their moneys worth (however they choose to value that.)

by Gin on Fri, 2006-12-22 23:15
With Ross I did belong to AOS. and found very little info. I could use .
Gin

by Bolero on Fri, 2006-12-22 23:46
I used to be a member and I must admit that I love the magazine. The problem is that the price of membership is to high for me. When converting US Dollars to my local currency it costs me nearly $100 to join.

Having said that I subscribe to 3 other magazines that are much cheaper.........Orchid Review (superior magazine) costs me $45 a year, Orchids Australia costs me $50 a year including membership to the AOC. Then Orchid Digest which is the best of them all costs around $70 I think in my money.

So how do I justify buying it? I can't!!!

I think renewals are cheaper than the initial subscription but still I think the price is a bit to high at this stage. Maybe next year.........;-)

by Waldorbigbill on Sat, 2006-12-23 12:23
I feel the same as a lot of you at the time. The price is way to much. Please feel free to add any input or comments I plan on sending anything that is written to the person I had dinner with. Like I said they want to make changes and they have already. The best way for them to do so is by your input.
Have Merry Christmas

by Ray on Sat, 2006-12-23 16:53
I have been an AOS member since the late '70's. I am nowhere near HQ, so cannot take advantage of anything there, so must judge the worth of my membership solely upon the magazine, and have found the utility to be waning over the years.

For me, it's a case of too many "fluff" or "eye candy" articles, and not enough science, but I'll acknowledge that some of that has more to do with my level of experience and personality than with the magazine. I actually perceive a bit of improvement over the last year or so, but I'll admit that - for the very first time - when renewal came up recently, I considered not doing so, weighing the cost/benefit relationship.

In the end I did renew.

by terrestrial_man on Mon, 2006-12-25 05:57
I have to agree that I found the AOS zines to be of no value and in having to choose between where I would put my subs money it went to Orchid Digest! The Digest is a much better presentation and a more interesting read!

by Heather on Mon, 2006-12-25 13:26
I'm with Ray, though I did like the reciprocal botanical garden membership.
It's just gotten too pricey and the magazine has too much fluff for me. I prefer Orchid Digest immensely!

In the end, I did not renew.

by Ray on Mon, 2006-12-25 15:20
I get Orchids, the Orchid Digest, and Phalaenopsis, but keep in mind I can write-off the cost to my business. If that was not the case, I'd likely limit myself to OD.

Here's another question to throw into the thinking: is the internet affecting membership and subscriptions?

Personally, I'd say "yes", and it is affecting them negatively. Think of this scenario: New grower, saw an orchid at the So-and-So Orchid Society show at the mall, and "had to" have one. Lack of experience and knowledge lead to almost killing the plant, so now there is a need to actually learn something. Where do they turn? The internet, of course. Why?

  • Don't have to shell out extra bucks for a magazine for which you don't know the value (and as we have already acknowledged, will disappoint and not serve the new grower all that well).
  • Don't have to leave home, go to a bookstore, search through the minimal array of orchid books to find one that might be what I need, AND shell out extra bucks to buy it.
  • Don't have to join a a society, where your lack of knowledge will be obvious to others and embarrassing (it's unfortunate that one doesn't realize that everyone in the society has "been there" and many of us realize we still have a great deal to learn).
  • If I DO have to join an online forum, it can be quite anonymous.
...and probably the "kicker" is:
  • There is more pertinent information available via a reasonable Google search than will show up in a year's subscription to any orchid magazine out there.
So the challenge for the AOS, in this case, is to publish a magazine that has a true, valuable benefit over and above the information available on the internet, while being of use to those not "connected" as well.

It would be interesting and useful to know the statistics on internet use and membership - percentage of online members over time as well as online versus not.

by Ross on Mon, 2006-12-25 17:13
While I am tempted to agree with Ray, I would have to say all is not lost with these Orchid Societies and their magazines. I, for one, belong to other "societies", the subject matter which I can get free info via the net, but I want to support their endevors. National Wildlife Federation, Wild Ones (a native wildflower group), etc. But I can't find the same efforts going on with AOS. If they can show me a strong fight to save rare species, a strong effort to educate young people in schools, a strong promotion to save disappearing forests and jungles, etc. then I would join simply to support those efforts. But the magazine is not worth the dues. And by the way I also can deduct these subscriptions as business expense (reference material).

by Phantasm on Tue, 2006-12-26 17:55
The AOS membership has dropped with the increase of dues. I currently subscribe to AOS, ODC, AQ, and the Slipper Orchid Alliance. As a judge I have no choice about an AOS membership or AQ subscription, but I do enjoy both publications.
Orchids magazine has to juggle between varied interests and expertise levels. Sometimes, I am frankly bored with it but they do have excellent issues concerning hybridizing, and species. Much of their focus is more towards beginning growers, but the pricing is driving them away.
Some changes are definitely brewing, starting with E-awards which will probably eventually lead to the printed AQ being phased out. I personally like the AQ even though it is cost prohibitive to publish.
The AOS is now allowing digital photography for awards photos beginning in January 2007, and the ability to email awards photos will cut some costs.
Perhaps eventually the Orchids magazine will be an online subcription.......

I agree with Ray about the effect of the internet, and the AOS needs to adapt. There is always something to be gained, however, from personal relationships and orchid societies.

by Paul on Sun, 2007-02-04 00:11
I've never had a great urge to join -- for all of the reasons others have already mentioned. In addition, I have had friends who did subscribe so if there was an issue I really wanted to read, I could just borrow it. Recently, a buddy of mine elected not to renew his subscription because of how much the price had jumped.

by nancy on Fri, 2007-05-04 20:13
I agree with many of the comments made about AOS membership; in essence, we are paying over $80 per year for a magazine subscription...a magazine that is lovely to look at, but seems to have a preponderance of articles dealing with novice-growing issues. I've already grown a Phal., and know where to cut/not cut the spike after blooming; already had a keiki on my Dendrobium, etc. Now I want to know more about less-common orchids.
While no magazine can be all things to all people, I do think that there is so much basic orchid-growing information available (on the 'net and at the local box stores, for that matter), that a magazine from the AOS just ought to be better than "ordinary." And while the photos are often superb, the content is very much "least common denominator."
Once you develop a taste for Brie, well, Velveeta just doesn't make the cut.
I remain a member because I am program director for our society, and we have to have a certain membership level to use educational materials from the AOS library...can you believe, slide programs? Time to drag AOS kicking and screaming into this century! Spend some of my dues to digitize, and put those suckers into a PowerPoint!

by Ross on Fri, 2007-05-04 20:15
Amen! That's why I chose not to renew years ago. Doubt you'll drag anybody in AOS into anything they don't want to go into.

by dennis on Sat, 2007-05-05 14:39
i joined signed up for two years. am i happy now no have i learned anything from it no do i care for the magazine no. will i rejoin nope not a chance. there is no information from them that i have not learned from reading from the net. i am sure i could learn more by joining a local society but i have no intention of ever having one of my plants judged for a award. i grow my plants for my wife and my enjoyment. i dont really consider the magazine as eye candy as they usally show ones that i am not interested in or would not be able to grow under my conditions. they say that they are trying to reach out to the newbies to help spark a bigger interest in orchids but have still not seen any info out there that would attract me as someone that would want to start up growing . i joined because of the name and figured i would gain more knowledge from them than anywhere else. this has not been the case. i am not really trying to bash them i think what they do is wonderful. i just do not think that they are truly a benifit to someone that is just started into growing or even a intermediate grower. true they had a great piece on growing phals but no one i know has conditions like texas a&m or taiwan. in my own opinion if you take a plant into be judged and do not recieve a award then it is like being told that you are not capable of growing something better than mother nature can grow well dah. and has anyone ever judged a actual plant growing in the wilds, in my eyes when i recieve blooms on my plants this is telling me that the plant is giving me a reward for doing a fine job handling the needs it desires, and i have never complained that the petals might not be perfect or it only gave me a dozen blooms instead of twenty. sorry for rambling on but as far as ever looking into a society or club again i will pass, i just dont think the knowledge gained is worth the price. i do not think the dues are to high if you are able to gain information on growing more complexed species and are really into recieving a award for your efforts other than what your plant is willing to give you

by Djarum Black on Sun, 2007-05-06 01:47
*giggles* Hey Dennis,

You just posted another thread that said you learned something bout Den's from "Orchids". (I'm just teasing you)

Personally, I like the AOS publication. It gives me something to wait for every month in the mail

I like the photos and I enjoy reading about the different growers around the country. I know it's not for everyone and that’s ok too.
On a similar note, my orchid society mentioned many people involved in societies and AOS are older. Older people tend to be set in their ways *snicker*. In other words the more younger people join, learn, grow..the more AOS will change to be what the next generation needs for it to be.
If everyone walks away as is...well nothing will change.

Just my two cents

by dennis on Sun, 2007-05-06 01:58
dont get me wrong i am not trying to bash the aos i think it is a great society. the research that they do is fantastic. i just do not see any real effort on getting new people to join. i really can not say i have not learned anything from them as i learn something from everything i read. it just does not do me justice in helping me with what i grow in the conditions i grow in. now to meet Yin-Tung Wang, Ph.D. would be great i could talk with someone like him for hours

by goodgollymissmolly on Sun, 2007-05-06 09:51
In every plant society you can raise a crowd by finding fault with the group and the central publication. In my opinion we would be in quicksand without a centralized organization to sort out all the false information that floats around on the internet and give some (even if minor) cohesion to our hobby.

Compared to other plant societies, AOS is expensive but it also provides a monthly magazine the quality of which exceeds some the descriptions I see in this thread. AOS also provides a permanent headquarters location with orchid displays. I must admit that whomever chose Delray Beach was on dope. (Before I say more let me tell you that I am a native Floridian who has nothing against the state). However, Delray Beach is so completely off on one corner of the planet (OK, US geography to be more precise) that it is useless to most potential members and therefore is not a positive asset to membership enhancement.

I subscribe to Orchid Digest and Orchid Review in addition to Orchids. I find value in all of them, and stuff I don't care about, too. I have OrchidWiz and AQPlus and find usefulness in both. I belong to two other plant societies and find them interesting and useful. HOWEVER, I find AOS to be the most valuable because it has a "permanent" staff that provides continuity through the elected administration changes and provides the permanent HQ rather than the continual address changes that occur in organizations without a permanent piece of real estate.

The current president (whom I don't know from Adam) seems to be a good executive who has some great ideas. The most important one is the establishment of a regional organization concept with regional bases of operation. That combined with the excellent judging backbone and judging center concepts puts AOS in a class by itself.

Things I do not like..... an HQ that almost missed being in the United States and MOST of all the noxious habit of putting "PhD" behind every name in the magazine. I've spent a career with highly educated peers and never do really accomplished people (with the exception of MD's) put titles after their names. If you really are intelligent people will notice, putting that suffix in print will not help.

Support your AOS because it is to your advantage for it to exist. Selfishness is not a sin. We need the organization and we need to support it....even if we wish to bitch on occassion.

Go buy some new orchids and join AOS!!! Quit the negativism.

by KEGinMichigan on Sun, 2007-05-06 23:33
I agree with you on some point regarding the AOS. I do agree that there needs to be at least one orchid organization with a strong foundation in the orchid world. I just do not think that the AOS is that organization any longer. I hope the regional idea becomes reality, but I think that the organization has to do more than just be regional.

As a part of this concept, the organization has to do more outreach to its affiliated societies. I do not think that the judging program suffices as a comprehensive outreach program. The outreach program can assist the affiliated societies with membership retention ideas. They can also have a direct presence at orchid shows. In addition, the organization can help with local orchid conservation efforts. These are just a few ideas that have been brewing in my mind. I have spoken with the new COO, Jim Jordan, about these issues and I hope he can help to bring about some of these and/or other worthwhile changes.

I understand that everyone has their preference with regard to orchid magazines. My preference is not 'Orchids'. I prefer Orchid Digest. I will pay the fee for this magazine, but I won't pay $60 for 'Orchids'. I understand that there other perks which come along with that fee, but I will not be visiting the AOS HQ in the near future. The discount to some botanical gardens around the country is not enough to justify the cost. This is just my opinion.

If the AOS makes some changes for the better within the few years, I will gladly rejoin. However, it's not worth it right now.

Kevin

by goodgollymissmolly on Mon, 2007-05-07 09:42
Thanks for your response,Kevin. I do not have any major issues with your thoughts, but I would like to point out that when offered a survey only 15% of the AOS membership responded with ideas and complaints. The other two plant societies I belong to get the same responses.....reduced membership, complaints about magazines, and complaints about dues (the other two are $29 and $30 per year).

AOS provides a wonderful judging system and a lot of cultural information. If people want more they need to respond to surveys or even send messages to the officers. Unfortunately, the bitching continues but when asked most people have no ideas to offer. They just want someone else to do something that entertains them.

I do not think that withholding your dues is an effective method to get whatever it is that you want. The this-quitting-will-continue-until-you-listen-to-me syndrome is not an effective tool to communicate. It is NOT the job of someone else to take care of us. It is our job to work to achieve what we want from an organization. You can not do that from outside, You can not do that by just whining. You have to be a part and make your desires known to someone who can help you achieve them.

Start by offering an article for Orchids. Offer to work at one of the regional centers if they actually materialize. I have already told you that I think putting an HQ in Delray Beach is not too smart and that academic-like use of the "PhD" is beyond silly. So I'm not above bitching. However, I put both those items on my survey....did ya'll put anything? The answer is not many of you.

Come on folks...let's get beyond internet complaining and make things happen. If that does not work then bitching might be in order.

Good growing ya' hear!

by Phantasm on Mon, 2007-05-07 17:12
I agree, it's much easier to complain than take part in the process of making changes. In my opinion, the problem extends much further than just the AOS. Almost all garden groups are seeing a diminishing membership these days, and it seems to me to be a social thing as much as anything.

My experience is that local orchid societies are also losing members at the same rate. In the past they were social clubs as well as a way of bonding with other people with common interests. That sort of community family seems to be dissolving these days as people find it easier to "talk" to their computers rather than develop relationships. Many people seem to have an extremely short attention span and ignore the depth of many issues, this is no different with orchids.

The AOS has it's issues, but I have noticed both an outreach by the new leadership and improvement with the Orchid magazine since the beginning of the year. Now if they could move the headquarters from hurricane alley to tornado valley. Well, maybe not....but having the HQ in Florida definitely isolates the membership.

by dennis on Mon, 2007-05-07 22:39
i filled out the survey and offered my opinions on what i would like to see. i would like to see more actual info and sound advice from the phd's to actually help the newcomers. something other than water weekly and fertilize weakly weekly.

by Ross on Mon, 2007-05-07 23:25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantasm View Post
My experience is that local orchid societies are also losing members at the same rate.
And yet, the Orchid Board continues to grow? Methinks it's not a general problem, but a problem with a bloated Society that continues to think they represent the mainstream when, in fact, they have no clue. It may be important to some folks to associate with the "mainline" group or society, but, for me, I find much more help and camaraderie and info here on Orchid-board and would give the same amount as I would in membership to AOS where it does most good. That ain't AOS (IMHO). I don't need a magazine (have several years worth) of ads and esoteric articles.

by goodgollymissmolly on Tue, 2007-05-08 09:39
Ross it is neither my job nor my calling to defend or help build AOS membership. While I can understand and respect your feelings, I think the internet negativity about society membership which is common here and elsewhere is very unhelpful. When you, a regular poster to this forum, has such negative attitudes regarding AOS you influence the thinking of potential new AOS members. Effectively you persuade them not to try out the organization and develop their own opinion. At the same time you do nothing to make changes inside AOS. Consequently your feelings have a negative effect with no corresponding positive consequences.

I am not knocking this or any other forum, but you must admit that much (most) of what you read on the internet is suspect or just wrong. There is no way for the new or novice reader to sort the good from the bad information. At least with internet or printed advice from AOS you have some assurance that the information has been filtered through their "PhD"'s. The judging system including training of judges and access to judging centers is spectacular. Support of that is important.

Apparently you like internet forums better than "official" publications and certainly that is your right. However, do you ever tire of the "me too", "very pretty", "I want one", "good growing"...posts that are meaningless and represent more of a "MySpace social interaction" than a serious orchid information source?

To each his own, but I'm interested in orchids not chit-chat. There is nothing wrong with preferring the chit-chat, but attempting to influence others to join the chit-chat and reject the positive attributes of AOS is nothing but self serving group building.

Personally, I think the internet has a lot to do with membership losses in all societies. Unlike some, I do not think this internet influence is good. It allows people to avoid personal contact, spreads a good deal of misinformation, and gives a forum to negative thinking. For some strange reason, positive thinkers will not enter the fray and spread their side of the story. I think they may have been shouted down by the naysayers in the past. I won't be intimidated by negativity. I won't go away unless the forum throws me off. I won't quit advising new people to join AOS and improve their orchid knowledge and help support the organization into the future.

It's time to abandon your keyborad and rejoin the world.

by KEGinMichigan on Tue, 2007-05-08 14:16
Goodgollymissmolly,

I think everyone here has had an opportunity to offer what they feel are good and bad points to the AOS. I would like to hear what good the organization has done. I also would like the opportunity to hear the bad too. I think that anyone who wishes to join the AOS should go in with eyes open.

I would assume that those wishing to send the organization $60 would take the time to research the organization. This research would include speaking with current and former members, reading forums such as this, and going to the organization's website. It also includes listening to the good and the bad about the organization. I don't think that this forum has deterred anyone from making their own decision about joining the AOS.

I am currently the President of an orchid society. We are experiencing a decline in our membership. The Internet may be one reason for this. I do not think it is the only reason. I believe it was Ross who said the some societies have lost touch with the public. I have to agree. It is the job of the societies to reconnect with the public to gain more members. It is also the societies' job to find out why members have decided not to renew. It is the societies' job to also make the necessary changes and spread the word about them.

I will continue to have my opinion about the AOS. If you want to share any other good information about the group, please, I would like to hear it. Right now, I just don't value the magazine or the judging program as you do. The information that they offer can be found in other sources such as books. I really don't need the AOS for anymore information.

Let me say this too. I will point people new to orchids to the AOS site. Specifically, I point them to the culture sheets. So, I do not deter people from seeking information about the AOS. Additionally, at our last show, some members and I gave away our old issues of Orchids and the AOS Bulletins. I know that I pointed to articles in which the people buying plants would be interested. These people now have a means of getting more information about the AOS and possibly joining. If someone new to this orchid board had a question about growing orchids and needed basic information, I would point them to a variety or sites including the AOS website. Doing all of this does not make me want to rejoin the AOS, though. I still have my feelings about the organization.

Rather than criticize those who have negative feelings towards the AOS, I would suggest telling us the good things that the organization has done. I, for one, would like to see links to articles or to their site telling about how it reached out to society or member 'a' in state 'b'. I would like to see the work outside of Florida and the membership meetings held at some remote show. Or, may be someone has a testimonial. Please inundate us with the good the AOS is doing. I think you'll get more people to join or at the very least take another look at the AOS. Isn't that what you want? Isn't that what the AOS wants?

I know that I want a more open AOS. I want one open to criticism and ideas. I want an AOS that does more outreach to Societies. I have expressed this to the AOS in one way or another. That's about all I'm going to offer. It is all that I can offer at this time.

Thanks,
Kevin

by Sharry on Tue, 2007-05-08 22:27
I thought that I would tell my experience with AOS as some one who just joined. Maybe it will help AOS members or other orchid society members understand how thing look to a new comber. I have been growing orchids on the window sill for about 8 years. I had the impression of very wealthy people wanting a social club and the gardens were nice but I left wanting something more. I wanted to see a collection of top hybrids and FCC winners or something.

This past year I decided to join based on their web site: magazine subscription, members only section and Free plant, I figured it would be worth the $60.00.

I do look forward to the journal, I like the photos and they have been having articles on Oncidium family plants which is one of my interests. But again as some others stated, I don't know if it's worth $60.00.

I have been disappointed over the other perks. The members only section is undeveloped. Most of the plants I typed in for the species encyclopedia section weren't there . I couldn't really figure out what I was getting a member that I couldn't have gotten for free. I don't go there anymore since they don't have the info that I am looking for. The free plant advertised is actually coupon that doesn't include shipping. So that free plant will cost me from $6 to 12 dollars and maybe it is a variety that doesn't appeal to me. I can get a nice out of bloom orchid for $5.00 -$15.00 at my local nursery. I never bothered to cashed it in.

FYI: I did fill out the survey. I hope it does pull itself together for the sake of the good works it does in conservation and improving orchid quality.

by Charles on Tue, 2007-05-08 22:53
I wish they kept a data base of previously judged orchids that can be searched. Let's face it, they should be the world's preeminent source of orchid everything.
??

by goodgollymissmolly on Wed, 2007-05-09 10:01
Kevin,

I will make my pitch to answer you and others. However, I hope you will keep in mind several facts.

1. No one designated me the spokesperson for AOS. Whatever I say is only my own opinion.

2. I do not propose to know everything, but I do know that a strong, central organization is vital to all of us and that this, mostly factless, bashing is not helpful.

3. I do not expect to change any minds here, but I hope to let new potential members know that there is a point of view different from the hardened, negative appraisals that are being put forth by some here.

4. I, too, have some differences with AOS which I have expressed. However, the only way to get some input into changes is to be inside. Sniping from outside is just that..sniping for no gain unless you just enjoy bashing something.

AOS provides a monthly magazine, ORCHIDS. You could not possibly look at the May 2007 issue and call this a poor magazine. One of the articles is a pictorial review of the 2006 FCC winners...it is a wonderful review of the top plants for the year.

The top plants have to be identified and the judging structure provided by AOS is the vehicle for this identification. Rember this includes recruitment of prospects, training, rules, sites and schedules, ongoing training and record keeping. A massive undertaking which is well done.

Record keeping. The Awards Quarterly and my favorite the e-AOS Awards (now AQ Plus). This is an amzing product with up to 40,000 pictures of awarded plants. The price is $50 per year including updates. Compare that to OrchidWiz (which I have and find useful) at $175 initially and $20 per quarter updates. The awards record keeping is vital to our hobby if only to let hobbyists know what new things are hot.

Curtural info, educational classes, twice yearly meetings of hobbyists, a visitors center with plants, sponsored research, and conservation activities and support. AOS also has an on-line forum similar to this one though somewhat less sophisticated in design. Why don't more members use that? I do not know.

All of those things cost money. Yes, I hate it that Delray Beach is in a far corner of the universe, but someone made that mistake some years ago and it is not easily remedied. The regional centers currently proposed might mollify that situation.

I just heard someone reading this say that you can utilize all those things except the magazine without paying $60 per year. You are right and that's where AOS might be making a big mistake. All plant societies seem to feel that offering their services to all is vital to their educational mission (and possibly their 501c3 status). I would like to see a restriction of some of this free activity. It allows freeloaders to get the benefits that many of us pay our dues to get.

What would happen if you could not get an award unless you were a member? I have no idea, but I know what allowing free access is doing.

What would happen if you could access technical information directly from experts in AOS through the forum? I don't know but I do know that asking Suzy Q about technical issues on this or any other internet forum is tempting fate because results are questionabvle at best and downright dangerous to both you and your plants at times.

I repeat what I said earlier at some risk to myself. These on-line forums are nice social sites but they are not substitutes for reliable information. There are all kinds of visitors to these sites that pretend to be something they are not and no way we can sort them out. In another plant interest I know of one admittedly crazy person who regularly hands out advice on issues that even the most experienced hybridizers do not pretend to know.

The minds I hope to influence are those who have yet to take a hard line opinion on AOS membership. The rest of you are beyond changing...you know it and by god that's it! That's OK, no problem, but your recruitment of others to your negativism infuriates me. If you don't have any competitive spirit that makes you want to show the world that you can grow orchids better than anyone else on earth that is OK. You have a right to your mediocre feelings and I mean that sincerely. The girls I run with are high-spirited winners and I encourage all you newer folks to resist the temptation to fall into the trap of whining without any effort to change things for the better.,

by nancy on Wed, 2007-05-09 12:04
goodgollymissmolly said <What would happen if you could not get an award unless you were a member?>
Though you don't have to be a member to get an award, you *do* have to pay a fee to have that award registered. And if the ID of the plant is debatable, you also will need to pay the fees of a registered taxonomist to have the species nailed down.
Though, when I win an award, I will pay that fee. It could happen.

by Dorothy on Wed, 2007-05-09 13:20
Gollymissmolly -

"What would happen if you could access technical information directly from experts in AOS through the forum? I don't know but I do know that asking Suzy Q about technical issues on this or any other internet forum is tempting fate because results are questionabvle at best and downright dangerous to both you and your plants at times."


Oh? You do know? How?
I don't believe, no .. I know it is NOT 'tempting fate' referring to knowledgable people who have experiences just as valid as any AOS member or society. I have learned so much at OB and will continue to do so. There is no 'perfect' way to grow, care, maintain and propagate orchids and everyone's input has a place and more importantly, is of great value on whatever level it may be.
I find that kind of superior attitude keeps people from joining .. Why would I want to be, no less pay to be with a group of people who thinks they know it all? .. That is the beginning of close mindedness! and the isolation that keeps the society distant from the rest of us who love to grow orchids for pleasure not just for status.
With that type of mindset .. I'd rather expend my time, share and exchange information and experiences with those outside any society.

"I repeat what I said earlier at some risk to myself. These on-line forums are nice social sites but they are not substitutes for reliable information. There are all kinds of visitors to these sites that pretend to be something they are not and no way we can sort them out. In another plant interest I know of one admittedly crazy person who regularly hands out advice on issues that even the most experienced hybridizers do not pretend to know."

So you judge everyone else by one person?
Or is that just signs of paranoia?
And who is to say whether or not someone else's experiences may eventually become the norm in the future. Isn't that how one learns?

"If you don't have any competitive spirit that makes you want to show the world that you can grow orchids better than anyone else on earth that is OK. You have a right to your mediocre feelings and I mean that sincerely."

I don't need to show the world that I can grow a better orchid ... I do it for my own pleasure and for the pleasure of those around me. In fact, I have a great passion not just mediocre feelings.
So get off your high horse and come down to Earth with the rest of us.
Maybe then some of us would consider societies such as the AOS!

by littlefrog on Wed, 2007-05-09 13:26
Non-AOS members pay more than AOS members for an award ($60 vs $40, I think?). Although that is hardly a problem, and I suppose if you got three or four awards at a show you could just join the AOS for a year to cover your costs...

As as judge (and PhD, although that isn't really relevant) in the AOS, even I find many annoyances. I've never tried the members only section of the website, I have enough other ways to satsify my internet addiction. In my opinion, the website is poorly designed and even more poorly implemented, even I could do better than that... I've never been to the palace of Delray Beach, and if I get there once or twice in my remaining lifetime I'd be surprised. I'm not at all supportive of that facility, we could go back to the days where we ran the AOS out of an office (or an office suite, maybe) and I'd be quite happy. I've offered my pole barn, but they didn't respond.

But, the AOS does do some good things too. We fund orchid research (I'm on the research committee), and orchid conservation, among other things. Not with as much money as I would like, but we don't have infinite money to spend. If it is a good project that needs to be done, we will fund it regardless of the cost. Main thing limiting more research support is that we lack good grant applications to fund (there were some pretty awful ones this year, and maybe two good ones). So, write a grant.

The magazine goes through phases... It is pretty good this year so far. It has been pretty bad in previous years. Again, it is a volunteer organization and nobody gets paid, so if you want to see something you care about in the magazine, write an article. I'd actually be supportive of a fund to pay contributors, similar to most other publications where the article authors are paid for their work (free-lancers). That would increase the article pool and no doubt the quality, but we'd have to find a way to pay for it. I like the inclusion of Lindleyana in the magazine, before it was a separate publication with very limited exposure.

And I think the judging program is important even if you don't get (or care about) awards. If there was no other reason, it ensures a pool of dedicated (we get paid in the high 6 figures, unfortunately every figure is a 0) and knowledgable orchid experts. Some are more expert than others, that is true. But we are all more than eager to help (and teach) where we can.

Rob

by Rhonda_in_FL on Thu, 2007-05-10 11:06
It is so hard to really put all of what I'd say on this subject into a forum reply. Of those that know me from other forums, any would certainly say I am a staunch 'pro' AOS-er. As others have said more eloquently than I have time to wordsmith, there have been some rocky spots.

Goodgolly is clearly informed on the new direction of AOS and her information is certainly current. The spring meeting was just finished days ago, so I expect she was either there or knows someone that was. I was there and I can say it was certainly full of excitment and enthusiasm for the future.

For those that have had negative experiences with the organization in the past, I would say that it is clear to me that the board of trustees acknowledges past mistakes and are making it their mission to turn the ship around.

I have talked with Carlos on several occasions in the past six months and know that he runs full tilt 24/7 to accomplish the goals he and the board have identified. The new COO, Jim Jordan, is amazing. His enthusiasm is exciting to be around--without specifying a person to blame on some of the issues we've all disagreed with, Jim is on a mission to make the organization into a vital, dynamic asset to the country. Jim even answers his own phone!

I am one of the fortunate that live in the vicinity of the AOS Visitors Center. The most common misconception around the country is that South Floridians were happy with the AOS...sometimes you read in the forums that the society has become a 'South Florida Society, not an American Society' THAT IS NONSENSE! We were irritated/unhappy/disconnected/dissatisfied too! That building was something near Morikami that wasn't worth the effort. Our issues with the building were adding to the dissatisfaction with the organization. Believe me, there is nothing further from the truth--that building was salt in the wound.

As a result of the 'disconnect' between the local societies and the AOS admin, the South Florida Leadership Council was developed. The presidents/AOS reps from the local societies started meeting and collaborating on solutions. It took several face-to-face meetings just to organize the complaints! That was a couple years ago and the complaints have started to fall off the list, one by one. Now the group is collaborating on issues to strengthen their home societies, benefit their members and incorporate the AOS in the solutions. In turn, AOS has benefited from societies being involved in AOS, more people in the area are joining/rejoining, and the Visitors Center is becoming the hub of orchids again. This is an oversimplified description, but in this setting It wouldn't make sense to go on and on.

Goodgolly has referred to the regional centers...the SFLC was the model and the inspiration for these centers. It has been so successful, the trustees have committed $$ and manpower to developing these regions across the country. They want the organization to be run from the bottom up instead of our (unsuccessful) efforts to run from the top down. No longer are the decrees coming from the mount on high--they want the individual members to have a vehicle to guide the organization. These regional centers are key to that change. I think the old model has been in place for so long that people didn't take this last survey seriously.

Do I blindly follow the AOS? NO!
Do I believe you're either part of the problem or part of the solution? YES!
My message to anyone is to watch and see--and be part of the solution! Be ready to be pleasantly surprised!

by dennis on Thu, 2007-05-10 21:25
what would be nice is a option to sign up for a month or two to see how it really is, then if you enjoy it you can stay if not you are not out much. me i am in for two years because i thought i was going to get the best top notch advice. i do go to the forum and read but have never really been given any sound advice on any post. i know thier forum is slow but there are alot of highly intelligent growers on there that just will not take the time to help out someone new. the only person i would say i see everywhere offering his knowledge is ray

by Rhonda_in_FL on Thu, 2007-05-10 23:27
As nice as a monthly membership might be, I am certainly glad I wouldn't have to keep track of it all.

I don't belong to any other national organization that would offer a monthly membership tied to an 80 page magazine, scholarship funds, affiliated societies, support staff, global judging system, etc. Imagine how difficult that would be to budget for and support?

by goodgollymissmolly on Fri, 2007-05-11 08:43
Rhonda,

Thanks for your informative, first-hand account of current AOS plans and progress. Hopefully information like you shared will come from others as well.

In response to your speculation that I might have been at the recent meeting, the answer is no. However, I think that's important because everything I know (or think I know) came from reading ORCHIDS. That proves that one can stay informed through the magazine.

by Rhonda_in_FL on Fri, 2007-05-11 11:04
They are making unprecedented efforts to communicate with every single member. Everything that happens in the organization is public (and easily accessible.)

Carlos is using space in the magazine each month to keep everyone very informed. For the old ex-AOS'ers that quit because of the closed door politics, this is a perfect example of the new outlook and the effort to revamp.

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