Generational ID for mericlones?
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Generational ID for mericlones?
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Old 08-30-2021, 09:19 AM
Mr.Fakename's Avatar
Mr.Fakename Mr.Fakename is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2020
Age: 27
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Generational ID for mericlones? Male

In an ideal world, this shouldn't even be a legitimate issue.

To get better at micropropagation I've read a LOT of books, essays and researches; and it's a well established thing that cloning a clone is bad practice (at best).

I don't think transparency towards customers is a concern for people who do that.
I fertilise my orchids with the ashes of the ones that didn't want to bloom.
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Old 08-30-2021, 11:54 PM
estación seca's Avatar
estación seca estación seca is offline
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Generational ID for mericlones?

Join Date: Jun 2015
Zone: 9b
Location: Phoenix AZ - Lower Sonoran Desert
Posts: 16,259
Generational ID for mericlones? Male

How would any buyer know? Few vendors sell plants they themselves mericlone.
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Old 09-10-2021, 08:46 PM
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Fairorchids Fairorchids is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Zone: 6a
Location: Maplewood, NJ
Posts: 2,683
Generational ID for mericlones? Male

Originally Posted by estación seca View Post
How would any buyer know? Few vendors sell plants they themselves mericlone.
Agree. However, there are cases where the seller just knows.

For example, I know that my tenant sold a mother division of Rlc. Goldenzelle 'Lemon Chiffon' to Exotic Orchids of Maui. So, when I buy meristems of this plant from EOM, I am confident that they are made from a mother division.

On the other hand, I bought Rth. Psycho Bride from a wholesale production nursery in HI. The flowers were pale yellow. Two years later, the plants coming out of the same nursery had pink flowers.
Kim (Fair Orchids)

Founder of SPCOP (Society to Prevention of Cruelty to Orchid People), with the goal of barring the taxonomists from tinkering with established genera!

I am neither a 'lumper' nor a 'splitter', but I refuse to re-write millions of labels.
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Old 09-12-2021, 11:51 AM
sbrofio sbrofio is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Zone: 8a
Location: Torino, Piemonte
Age: 40
Posts: 643
Generational ID for mericlones? Male

As I know, F1 stands for "first generation from seed". F2 for "second generation referred to one of the plant granmother or grandad".
Pratical exemple.
A: P. rothschildianum
B: P. micranthum.

F1 is Paphiopedilum Gloria Naugle (cross between P. rothschildianum x P. micrantum), that has intermediate characteristics between the parents.
F2 is, for example, Paphiopedilum Du Motier ( cross between P. Gloria Naugle x P. vietnamense). You can see the strong influence of P. rothschildianum and the weak influence of P. micranthum in the second generation.

Backcross is A crossed with B and the result C again crosse with A or B.
so Paphiopedilum Tristar Red Dragon is a backcross of P. Gloria Naugle with P. rothschialdianum, to improve the influence of P. roth.

For division, in Italy we use D or "divisione", and it's a part of the plant, usually the awarded ones, so the division is EXACTLY the same. The original plant you divide is "motherplant".

Meristem or merclone we usually write M or "mericlone". It's used to multiplicate very fast an awarded plant in huge numbers. For example an awarded Cattleya, you make mericlone to reproduce exactly that Cattleya, but everytime the DNA multiplicates and divides (saying simple..), some mistakes can be made. So the results is not always identical to the mother plant.

That's why the differences in prices and value.
Division is the most desired: EXACTLY the same plant as awarded, so the most expensive.
Mericlone: almost as perfect as divisions, but in huge numbers (thousands..) you can have degeneration of DNA and so of the plant. Rarely the mutations give some better results. Rarely.
Seedling: with no flowers we can expect results similar to parents, better o lower ones. Good luck!

"X self" or autoimpollination usually done with botanical species, should improve some charateristics of the plant.
In tag we use "x s" or "x self".

I like to know this stuff because when buying plants outside Italy, you know what you're buying. Well, more or less

Hope it helps
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hellas, meristem, original, plant, westonbirt

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