Should I re-re-pot?

[PinkCloud]

Hello!

So I re-potted one of my phals 3 weeks ago. I think I watered it too soon and didn't give it enough time to settle in its new mix. Now it is showing a few rotten roots. What do yous think I should do? re-pot it? AGAIN? Cut out the rotten roots? New mix?
Or should I give it a chance to settle down and see how far the damage goes? And come back to it in a few weeks time?

[Val]

I was in a similar situation some 50 days ago - and now my poor Phal has no roots at all .

In my experience, water + damaged roots = root rot, almost certainly. And when repotting, there's bound to be some root damage, but it's almost impossible to tell where and to what extent. My conclusion for the future is as follows:

I would soak the roots for 30 minutes before repotting. This way, the roots will get as much water as they need, they will become more flexible, and the plant will be able to resist without watering for 2-3 weeks.

Then I would dry the roots surface, using an absorbant paper towel.

Then I would cut rotted and dried roots and sprinkle cinnamon on the cut surface (but not on healthy roots!).

Then I would repot in almost-dry medium (not moist!) and refrain from watering for 2-3 weeks. Roots need 2-3 weeks for healing any damage.

I would mist the medium surface every day (only before noon!) during those 2-3 weeks, just to provide some humidity, but I would not water. This would also stimulate the plant to grow some new/branching roots, looking for water.

I hope that experience growers will chime in and confirm (or not) the above.

[camille1585]

Providing that you have a good quality medium to begin with, I think your course of action is maybe a bit too much.

I soak my fresh medium overnight and repot directly with it (basically it's dripping wet when I use it). The orchid is unpotted and I let the roots soak 10min to soften them up, then I repot. As for watering I don't change my normal routine, they still get watered when they need it. (I use clear pots so I can easily see when the roots need water.) I use fir bark only, and that tends to dry out very quickly the first 3-4 months until it's 'broken in' and able to absorb water well. If anything I'm watering more often than usual for those few months. Keep in mind that what I'm describing is for my conditions and the medium I use.

Pink cloud, what sort of medium are you using? Most of the commercially available mixes have way too much fine dirt like stuff. As for 3 weeks being 'too soon' too water, it depends on the environment (temperature, humidity) as well as the medium.
As for repotting again, if there are quite a few dead roots it may be a good idea so that you can get it into a smaller pot. Do you ave any pics?

[PinkCloud]

Val -> Thanks for the advice. See.. that is basically what I did the first time.. about 3 weeks ago. But now I can see a few rotten roots, so I am wondering should I go through the same process again. or wait a little longer and see how it develops.

camille1585 -> I use a medium bark and coir coco mix for my phals. Obviously it was potted in a damp mix and I watered it twice since the repotting.. I can see two roots that aren't looking too good in the pot. I'll see if I can get a few pics up for you.

[Val]

Originally Posted by PinkCloud

... so I am wondering should I go through the same process again. or wait a little longer and see how it develops.

I sincerely doubt that it could get better by itself. If there's root rot, there's bacteria in there. In my experience, the bacteria won't stop spreading - at least if the potting medium is wet.

My Phal had a mossball in the center of the pot, but I discovered this too late (became suspicious when I saw that the medium dried much slower than the other Phals in the same conditions). I repotted, and root rot went on. Then I re-repotted, but stil continued to water as usual (maybe a little less). The other possible cause of failure is that I didn't use any antibacterial solution. Since then, I have ordered Physan 20 and KLN (they should be in any day now), but my Phal is completely rootless now (and will be my first rescue project).

[PinkCloud]

Val -> have you thought about the spagh bag method for your phal? there is a lot of info about it here on the board.
I agree that it my phal wont be getting any better in the way it is now.. I guess it's best to just repot.
How many times do you think I can re-pot in a short period of time? Obviously every re-potting will cause even more stress to the plant.

[Val]

Originally Posted by PinkCloud

Val -> have you thought about the spagh bag method for your phal? there is a lot of info about it here on the board.

That's what I've been doing for two weeks, and it seems OK so far. Actually it's "variation on the theme", with a plastic box instead of a bag and wet towel instead of moss.

Originally Posted by PinkCloud

I agree that it my phal wont be getting any better in the way it is now.. I guess it's best to just repot.
How many times do you think I can re-pot in a short period of time? Obviously every re-potting will cause even more stress to the plant.

Let's think about what's stressing in a re-potting: adjusting to the new medium (which can be very different from the old one) and the inherent damages to the roots. Your Phal's roots are already damaged, so their adjusting capacity is close to nil.

Anyway, I believe re-potting stress is not life-threatening, but merely dangerous for any buds/blooms and new growth. But we're talking about saving the Phal's life. With healthy roots, it will recover completely, as the re-potting could only set it back a few weeks.

So my answer (to you as well as to myself) will be: re-pot as many times as it takes until you (I) can do it without (re)doing mistakes.

In my case, I didn't use any antibacterial/antifungal and I watered too soon. Lessons learned - the hard way. Today Physan 20 and KLN arrived by mail, and now I (think I) know what I have to do.

PS
Ironically, when I repotted it the first time it occured to me that I could keep it bare-rooted in a high humidity enclosed space (the very box it is in now), to keep an eye on its roots. It just seemed to make sense. But at the time I hadn't read of anybody having done something like this (I didn't know about "sphag&bag") so I gave up on the idea. After the second re-potting I found out about "sphag&bag", but didn't want to disturb it again. Live and learn...

[PinkCloud]

Val -> Your "But we're talking about saving the Phal's life!" made me picture myself as a surgeon in some hospital soup! 'hand me the scalpel nurse! We are going to need to cut these rotten roots off! A life is at stack here!!' I'll start re-potting then! And btw good luck with your 'box & towel' method. I like it.. hahaha!

[Val]

Why don't you sphag&bag?