Defeated by black background -- looking for pointers

[bethmarie]

I've tried to take good shots of orchids in front of a black backdrop and I'm gettin' nowhere.

I have a decent older point and shoot --Panasonic lumix dmc fz28. I have zero knowledge about manual settings and I'm still educating myself on the many possibilities with the auto setttings on this camera. I can take good, crisp shots, just not in front of a black background.

I've attached an example of the quality that I'm getting when I shoot in front of black. The comparison photo (2nd one) is not great either, but shows the dullness I'm getting in front of black. Any pointers that would benefit a relative novice in photography are much appreciated!

[estación seca]

The luscious photos of plants you often see here are probably taken with two side flash units slaved to the camera, or two high-intensity lamps, and a reflecting umbrella. The closest you will come to that with a point-and-shoot will be taking the whole setup outside in bright direct sunlight.

[theloyalplum]

I use a point and shoot. Definitely go for the manual settings. The most important part in my very beginner photography is adjusting white balance (if you can) ISO and exposure to get the most accurate colors and details that you can. Surprisingly, my 5 year old, compact camera takes better photos than my friend's phones!

Black backgrounds are nice, but you can take good photos without it.

[silken]

All cameras want to turn the black into grey. Same with the white. They're metering system is geared around 18% grey. That's to even out deep shadows and over exposed objects. So keeping that in mind, you need to trick it or tell it that it is black that you want. Try and focus-which with a point and shoot is also metering on the plant, not the black. Then it should correctly expose the plant, provided it isn't an extremely light or dark bloom. Set the plant at least 2 feet away from the black background. That will also help. Definitely use manual if you can so that you can control your shutter speed and aperture. Or at least the A for aperture priority or S for shutter speed priority. If it is on manual, you could under expose it a bit if black is not coming out as a deep black. Also if you have different metering modes, pick one that only meters a small area and then that will be the plant. Not the overall scene, which includes a lot of black.

I prefer no flash at all. Just daylight in the window and many things will work as a reflector to bounce a bit of light back into the shadowed side. Or a real reflector from the camera store isn't real expensive either. But I like a tripod then so I can have a longer shutter speed.

Definitely set your white balance for the lighting situation (ex. flash, cloudy day, fluorescent lights etc.)

If you really want to control the camera, you need to read the manual and know where the controls are and what they do. That is the best way to not let the camera be the boss.

[tucker85]

I agree 100% with Silken. First of all, if you get better photographs with a white background then that's what you should use. It doesn't have to be black. It's very difficult to get the proper exposure using a black background and automatic settings. The camera is trying to get an average light setting and most of the frame is dark black. If you want to use black, then experiment with manual settings. You also want the background far enough behind the plant that it's not in focus. I keep my background about 5 feet behind the orchid. I use natural light in bright shade. Bright sunlight is hard to work with. I recommend using a tripod and the timed shutter release or a remote shutter release. Also there's some inexpensive photo software that will allow you to make the photo lighter or darker. Many of the programs also have a way of sharpening the photo. But you can only do so much with software. Taking a good picture is the first step.

[silken]

And I agree 100% with tucker85. Even an inexpensive tripod, gives you a lot of freedom to use longer shutter speeds. To get good focus on a plant over all you often need a small aperture (large numbers like f11 or f16). That means the opening to let light in is very small, so to make up for that, you need a slower shutter speed. With hand holding the camera, there is too much movement.

So many people say you need a bright sunny day and clear skies to take a good picture. Not true and not even the best condition. Harsh bright days cast a lot of shadow. So a cloudy day or an even light source is better. Anything reflective used to bounce a bit of light into the underside of the bloom or the side facing away from the light source if it's a window or the sun, will even things out and prevent shadows. And I always use a remote shutter release which enables me to do my photography by myself in most cases. Then I can hold the reflector in one hand and press the remote shutter release. It prevents touching the camera which could cause movement too. But I know, lots of point and shoots likely don't have remote shutter capability. They do have timers tho.

Software is very helpful to finish off the photo but the best plan is to get the best results you can in the camera. Software can only do so much if it is a poor picture in the first place.

[Triffid]

No expert here, but for backgrounds whilst taking shots there may be hope for pure black!
NASA - Blacker Than Black
It

Though it may be a while before the availability for the general public is a reality. Just thought you photographic enthusiasts may want to keep you eye open for this substance in the future.

Thanks for asking the question Beth, and thanks to everyone else who replied. I have learnt something today

[AnonYMouse]

There is an industrial paint color called "super black". Used in laser devices because it has zero refraction/reflection. I would love to use it for a background.

Has absolutely nothing to do with Beth's post.

[u bada]

My simple but worth reiterating tips:

-Usually P&S cameras have autofocus... so just keep half pressing button until it beeps and the flower or part of flower is in focus the way you want. there's usually a face recognition that will pick up on larger flowers like catts. (with small flowers it's a different ballgame) It should automatically adjust ISO, f/stop, shutter, aperture so you shouldn't have to worry about it.

-lighting is one of the big keys to photography, if not most important... with P&S especially, as noted here already, white balance (usualy noted as WB on camera) is an important button for getting coloring right, although you can correct on software.... diffuse light is actually best, bright cloudy day weather, for most flowers. Direct sun is too bright and can throw other levels off on camera for flowers. without fancy light setup, rigging a work light with some sort of opaque tupperware over bulbo housing will do. Point at flower angled from top diagonal tends to be most natural. You really want light on the plant and not on the black background. This is the key. If light is only on the flower than the background tend to go dark anyway regardless.

While I happen to love black background, I also love non black background and actually people just seem to do less of that for flowers, so i think you're better off just keeping to non black if that's what you do well.

Also, as I used to assist photographers as a side job as well as my photo projects, setting up backdrops are such tedious pain! You can't imagine how much goes into shooting a plate of food, or just 3 different outfits on a model... Even more the reason to focus on shooting things without black backdrops...

happy shooting!

[My Green Pets]

Just a tangent, but had to chime in:

I can't stand the black backgrounds. Could anything be more unnatural?

Orchids are meant to be seen against green, leafy or brown, woody or grey, stony backgrounds. They do not ever [?] appear in front of a black backdrop in nature.

Sorry, had to rant about this.