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  #1  
Old 02-13-2020, 12:05 PM
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Some of you may be aware of my enthusiasm over the use of Inocucor Garden Solution, a "plant probiotic" that contains multiple consortia of beneficial microbes, that prevent all sorts of diseases and helps plants grow stronger. It also has a dramatic effect on the survival of ex-flask seedlings, and a large percentage of my sales are to professional breeders for that purpose.

I have just learned that the manufacturer has shut down the manufacturing facilities in Montreal and their less-than-1-year-old HQ in Denver.

Yet another victim of corporate greed: Their biological products are fantastic, so they got a bunch of investors to allow expansion. Along the way, they acquired a large-scale fertilizer manufacturer in Canada. The investors apparently decided not to wait for the market for Inocucor to develop, focusing on short-term profits with the fertilizer side, instead.

I purchased the balance of their inventory in 500 ml bottles, and have posted a method of using it as "seed stock" to brew your own going forward, a la sourdough bread.
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Old 02-13-2020, 01:13 PM
DirtyCoconuts DirtyCoconuts is offline
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Sucks a lot

---------- Post added at 12:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 PM ----------

Glad I literally ordered a new bottle this morning !!
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Old 02-13-2020, 02:01 PM
thefish1337 thefish1337 is offline
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super bummed out by this. inocucor is a great product and its going to be a tough sell to my wife for me to ferment my own...

I've done a little digging and research though and a few companies make products with just B. subtillis and market them as a biofungicide. Roy from H&R orchids mentions he uses promix with bacillus subtillis for his deflasked orchid seedlings. For people out there looking specifically for an anti-fungal component they may want to look into these products.
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Old 02-13-2020, 04:56 PM
DirtyCoconuts DirtyCoconuts is offline
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i'm pretty sure i can just use my pickling buckets for this as i have them outfitted with a burp valve
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Old 02-13-2020, 05:59 PM
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There are two other products out there - Quantum Orchid and EM-1, but carry only 2- and 1 type of microbe, respectively, a mere fraction of what is in Inocucor.
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  #6  
Old 02-14-2020, 03:03 PM
thefish1337 thefish1337 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray View Post
There are two other products out there - Quantum Orchid and EM-1, but carry only 2- and 1 type of microbe, respectively, a mere fraction of what is in Inocucor.
Very true Ray, but its highly likely that their specific strain of B. subtilis is the major source of the antifungal fermentation by products in the mix. Its also one of the major strains listed on the label. While one species may not be as good as Inocucor people who are using the product for flasking/raising seedlings or to reduce the fungal burden in their collections may be able to find an ag product containing B. subtilis to achieve something similar. Here is a reference suggeting that the addition of chitin to the culture media increases the amounts of these compounds:

Production of antifungal compounds from chitin by Bacillus subtilis - ScienceDirect
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Old 02-14-2020, 05:33 PM
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I am not a microbiologist, but I donít know how you can say one particular species is responsible. According to the paperwork that comes with the imports, Inocucor contains the following:

Bacillus subtilis
Lactobacillus helveticus
Saccharomyces cerevisiae
Rhodopseudomonas palustris
Lactobacillus casei
Lactococcus lactis
Aspergillosis oryzae
Candida utilis
Lactobacillus plantarum
Lactobacillus rhamnosus


The stuff they put on the label is what they guarantee in terms of content of the total. They verify that the rest are present before packaging it, but donít guarantee a certain microbe count.

Itís just like fertilizer - if you have a formula that contains 19.9% N, 0.9 P2O5, and 4.9% K2O, legally you guarantee it to be a 19-0-4 formula - zero P, even though you know itís there.
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Last edited by Ray; 02-14-2020 at 05:41 PM..
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  #8  
Old 02-15-2020, 12:35 AM
thefish1337 thefish1337 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray View Post
I am not a microbiologist, but I donít know how you can say one particular species is responsible. According to the paperwork that comes with the imports, Inocucor contains the following:

Bacillus subtilis
Lactobacillus helveticus
Saccharomyces cerevisiae
Rhodopseudomonas palustris
Lactobacillus casei
Lactococcus lactis
Aspergillosis oryzae
Candida utilis
Lactobacillus plantarum
Lactobacillus rhamnosus


The stuff they put on the label is what they guarantee in terms of content of the total. They verify that the rest are present before packaging it, but donít guarantee a certain microbe count.

Itís just like fertilizer - if you have a formula that contains 19.9% N, 0.9 P2O5, and 4.9% K2O, legally you guarantee it to be a 19-0-4 formula - zero P, even though you know itís there.
I'm not an expert but I have worked in microbiology for the last few years and I've done a lot of research into inocucor just based on pure interest. My education is in biology and chemistry. The product has always interested me hence why I reached out to you via email when I stumbled across the avocado grower in Florida who had shown a method to expand the product via fermentation.

based on my research some components promote nutrient exchange or produce plant growth promoting or regulating products. others produce enzymes which promote nutrient cycling in the rhizosphere. other components produce antifungal/antibactierial compounds. furthermore, some components provide a benign population that will take up surface area and exclude disease.

Bacillus subtilis has a lot of research into its antifungal abilities, AND its already used as a biofungicide in other ag products. None of the other species have near the volume of published literature related to antifungal compounds. Roy Tokunaga of H&R orchids mentions that Pro-Mix BX biofungicide is part of his method for high survival rates of deflasked seedlings. Bacillus subtilis is a component of this mix. I'm not saying that there isn't further anti-fungal effects of the other species in the mix I'm just saying its highly likely that the heavy hitter is Bacillus subtilis.

Here is a timestamp of Roy talking about peat with Bacilus subtilis reducing his need of fungicides when growing deflasked seedlings:

2016 - Roy Tokunaga (Tetraploid Breeding) 6th Annual Cattleya Symposium - YouTube
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  #9  
Old 02-15-2020, 09:24 AM
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Iím not doubting that at all. My understanding from the two PhDs that started the company is that each species has its own impact, whether that be predation of specific pathogens, secretion or specific antibiotics or stimulants, or in the cases of the yeasts, generating a hyphae network to extend the effectiveness of the root system.
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Old 02-15-2020, 02:59 PM
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Ray, would you have any information about the effectiveness of homebrewed Innocucor after several generations? I know from culturing mixed cultures of microalgae that some species tend to predominate over time, while others disappear entirely.
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