What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf?
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  #1  
Old 10-04-2019, 09:52 AM
Dollythehun Dollythehun is offline
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What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf? Female
Default What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf?

I noticed this yesterday. What do you guys make of it? I'd think it was mechanical or edema but, I had another phal succumb a couple months ago. Temperature has been stable, humidity in the 50% range, watering the moss as it approaches dryness. It could have been dripped on and that is very hard to 100% eliminate.

I've lost a lot of plants this summer and I'm pretty sore, so be gentle.
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  #2  
Old 10-04-2019, 03:33 PM
Shadowmagic Shadowmagic is offline
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What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf?
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shame to hear you lost a few this year. The most important thing is to find out exactly why it happened.

That damage to that leaf does not look serious. There are a few things that could cause it - not too important if it was squashed or created another way - as long as it does not spread. There is no indication from the picture that there is any rot or anything there at the moment so that won't kill your plant.

just a ps: everyone has different growing methods - what works for some doesn't work for others so I know shops, bloggers and guides tell you spagnum moss is fine to use on phals. To me it's a sure fire way of killing them.



Like said everyone has their own methods - spagnum is not a beginner's medium - I would not recommend it. Probably what kills most phals in shops. Never had an issue with a plant potted in bark.

Last edited by Shadowmagic; 10-04-2019 at 03:39 PM..
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  #3  
Old 10-04-2019, 03:43 PM
rbarata rbarata is online now
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What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf? Male
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Probably Edema...the plant absorbs more water than it can expel.

Carol, didn't noticed it was you! Welcome back!
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Last edited by rbarata; 10-04-2019 at 03:52 PM..
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  #4  
Old 10-04-2019, 03:52 PM
sweetjblue sweetjblue is offline
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It could be mesophyll cell collapse.

It can occur if orchids are exposed to very low air or water temperatures, which usually occurs on the coldest nights. Low water temperature 35° to 45° F; , or water that is more than 25° F lower in temperature than the plant’s leaves, can cause the mesophyll cells to collapse. Watering, spraying or overhead misting of plants with cold water, or even cold condensation falling onto leaves can cause this problem.

As most people do not see the symptoms until weeks after they have occurred, it can be difficult to relate them to cold damage.

Sorry to hear of your orchid troubles , hopefully they are behind you.

Judi
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  #5  
Old 10-04-2019, 04:01 PM
Orchid Whisperer Orchid Whisperer is offline
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What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf? Male
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Three possible ideas:

1. Spider mite damage

2. Slight sun damage

3. Mesophyll collapse (sometimes from low-temp thermal damage; I don't think Indiana has been cold enough for that yet this autumn).
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  #6  
Old 10-04-2019, 04:10 PM
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Ray Ray is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orchid Whisperer View Post
Three possible ideas:

1. Spider mite damage

2. Slight sun damage

3. Mesophyll collapse (sometimes from low-temp thermal damage; I don't think Indiana has been cold enough for that yet this autumn).
Agreed, but cold water can cause mesophyll collapse, too. Especially if the leaves were hot when watered.
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Old 10-04-2019, 06:09 PM
Dollythehun Dollythehun is offline
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Shadowmagic, I used to grow exclusively in bark. Then I stared switching over to a moss mix. I have not lost a plant yet to root rot. Probably because I'm aware of the hazard of overwatering. If anything, my plants run too dry. I also water sparingly in the winter because my greenhouse window runs cold. (Have a replacement on order $$$). This plant was not I that cold window last winter.
Judi and rbarata, thank you. It's been an interesting year.

OW and Ray, it could have been dripped on and I didn't see it to wipe it off. Cold wouldn't be the issue but, sunlight could have hit it while it was wet.

Ray, I watch carefully for mites. I did just apply a systemic in case it's something else. Should I cut the leaf off? I don't know how long it's been that way because that plant a little high and that leaf was turned away from my view. Suggestions are welcomed.

I also have another bizarre question but one a day is enough lol
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Old 10-05-2019, 08:27 AM
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I would not take the drastic action of removing that leaf unles you see the would spreading.

And for the record, I don't believe that water droplets can be "lenses" that concentrate sunlight and cause burn damage. It seems to me that if the leaf surface under the droplet was getting warm enough to start doing damage, it would be warm enough to accelerate the water evaporation, too.
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  #9  
Old 10-05-2019, 10:44 AM
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WaterWitchin WaterWitchin is offline
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Now that I see a closeup, it could be edema. Can kind of see it at the ends of where the drier part is. But you've had great ventilation going on. My votes are for edema or mesophyll cell collapse.

I'm with Ray, certainly wouldn't cut off the leaf at this point. I had some edema going on a couple of orchids outside that I caught early on. I dabbed a little cinnamon on the spots of a couple, and it appears to have stopped. Just a thought. Move it down into better eyesight range and start that watchful waiting game.

On the sphagnum medium part... I do agree it's not a great "beginner's" choice. But can be an excellent choice for a non-novice, especially with phals. You're in the latter category...it's just been a super hard year climate-wise in both your state and mine...rain, cold, heat and humidity, rain and more cold, rinse and repeat ALL season long. A part of me wishes I'd left mine inside this year instead of "summering" outside. {{ugh}}

Last edited by WaterWitchin; 10-05-2019 at 10:56 AM..
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  #10  
Old 10-05-2019, 11:04 AM
rbarata rbarata is online now
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What is this disturbing damage on my phal leaf? Male
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Carol, good info about both disorders here.
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