Cymbidium's ~ Feathered .. - Page 3 - Orchid Board

Orchid Chikk Aussie Land · #21 08-29-2020, 10:10 PM

There have been several ' Feathered ' discussions here in Aussie Land . .

As we all know,
You need a Division,
From the parent plant.
Like the First one I posted.
Only 1 in 500, actually flower like it.

On the last one,
It's been Questioned . .
And many Don't believe,
It flowers, as the parent plant from a seed.
Again,
They believe the only way,
Is to take a piece of the the Division.

IF they were common,
And did grow from a seed,
Why are they Rare ?
Instead they are,
Very hard to find.
And you Don't see them often.

SouthPark · #22 09-09-2020, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orchid Chikk Aussie Land

Why are they Rare ?
Instead they are,
Very hard to find.
And you Don't see them often.

Not sure OCAL. Not sure why. Are those feathered friends from divisions? Or mericlones?

Roberta · #23 09-09-2020, 12:59 PM

If it is a mutation, it can be reproduced by mericloning if it is stable. Some mutations are not stable, and those can only be reproduced by division. If that is the case, the plants are going to be very rare - and expensive.

SouthPark · #24 09-09-2020, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roberta

Some mutations are not stable, and those can only be reproduced by division. If that is the case, the plants are going to be very rare - and expensive.

If a mutation (original plant) is unstable, then does that mean that the original plant can revert back to un-mutated form too? And if that is the case, then is there any difference between a mericlone-type of clone (of that unstable mutated plant) and a division? By clone, I mean an exact match of DNA between the clone and the original plant. Thanks Roberta!

Roberta · #25 09-09-2020, 02:05 PM

I wouldn't expect the original plant to revert. But some mutations just don't show up in mericlones, especially with any reliability. (When I bought Cymbidiums, which I don't any more because they're too big, I have been disappointed in peloric mericlones that didn't have the strong peloric characteristics of the original). Genetics can be very complicated.

For what it's worth, the phenomenon is very common in the Neofinetia falcata world, where unique mutations can lead to highly-prized, and VERY expensive plants... because they don't show up in mericlones, can only be propagated by division. Check out the recent Neofinetia falcata discussion thread on this very topic.

Mr.Fakename · #26 09-09-2020, 02:56 PM

This article is a bit dense and not orchid-related, but there's lots of super interesting information regarding different types of mutations and how they work:

Plant chimeras: The good, the bad, and the ‘Bizzaria’ - ScienceDirect

That said I'm still a bit puzzled as to why it seems so hard to stabilise a mutation.
With all the cloning techniques that were developed, the understanding of plant biology getting better and better and so on, it should be possible to clone pretty much everything, no?

I understand that cloning from a root or a leaf section isn't going to be perfect; but on paper using a node should give the exact same characteristics, since the plant uses those to grow new divisions.
What am I missing here?

Roberta · #27 09-09-2020, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Fakename

I understand that cloning from a root or a leaf section isn't going to be perfect; but on paper using a node should give the exact same characteristics, since the plant uses those to grow new divisions.
What am I missing here?

There are a lot of people who know a lot more about this than I do... but if it were straightforward (or even merely difficult), somebody would be making a fortune propagating some of these oddities.

Diane56Victor · #28 09-09-2020, 05:48 PM

There has been two feathered Cyms on ebay Australia in the past week.
A seedling that sold for just over $20 and a mature, flowering plant that was offered at a starting price of $220, no takers at 1 hour before the auction ended, just checked and it sold for $235.50.