So is this a keiki?

[Maxy24]

This is my very, very sad orchid.


It's looked like this for a few years now. Earlier this year it tried to grow that new little leaf, but then is stopped because I got busy and let it go dry. It's just been sitting like this for several months. I tried to recreate the conditions it was in when it started growing that leaf (sphagnum, kept moist) but nothing happened. And then a week or so ago I noticed a little growth at the base. I was afraid it was a last ditch effort at a flower spike but as it's grown I'm starting to think it's a keiki.






What do you think? If it is a keiki what do I do? Just leave it be? When would it be able to live independently? I hope it does well, I've pretty much given up any hope of the main plant recovering, so a new little plant would be nice if it can do well despite an unhealthy "mother" plant.

[jmmehler]

Couple of observations. Not sure how long this plant has been in that little black ceramic pot, but judging by the striations of the leaves, I'd assume that your roots have rotted out because of too much moisture, and the leaves are consequently not getting the moisture that they need.

The last picture shows what looks like a healthy root. The keiki may very well be the last dying act of the mother plant.

At the very least, you might consider placing it in a larger, more ventilated pot, so that if new roots should develop, that they get a little more air, and possibly not drown.

[sweetjblue]

Maxy, yes that is a keiki, its what is called a basal keiki.

The mother plant is desiccated, it stayed too dry for too long, and this is an effort to live on.

Your keiki is way too young to be removed from the mother. It would have to have a couple of roots at least 2-3 inches long before you do so.

The mother plant looks like it could still be saved as it does have a root that is still green. First thing I would do would be to repot into fresh moss. Use a smaller pot, the one its in now is too big and will take too long to dry. Do not let it dry out completely tho, only let it approach dryness before watering again. And only water to moisten the moss, you don't want it to be soggy.
It will also help the mother plant to rehydrate if you spray the underside of the leaves but make sure you only do this early in the day.

Good luck in your efforts, hope all turns out well for you!

Judi

[Maxy24]

Yes the roots did rot, but that was in 2012 while it was planted in regular old potting soil. I started to notice a little wrinkling on the leaves, did some research, and learned soil was not the right substrate for orchids. Then I cut the dead roots off (leaving it's little healthy air roots to be the main roots for the plant), moved it from soil to bark and all the leaves started shriveling up and dying off even faster. It didn't like how dry it was in bark I guess, I was watering it once a week but I guess it wasn't enough. Plus I'm sure there was some shock from having it's roots hacked off. It went from 7 leaves to 4 leaves in 3 months. Then sometime in the next 6 months (while in bark) it lost 2 more, leaving it with just two leaves. The roots were still healthy. SO then I moved it to coir but didn't pack it in, just sort of stuck it in a hole in the coir (very fine coir). It grew two new roots. Orchid forum people (not this forum) convinced me to get it out of the coir, it would rot, put it in bark. So back into bark. The new roots continued to grow for a little while, it started to grow a new leaf. But a month or two after putting it into the bark it stopped growing. I kept it like that for a while, alive but not doing anything. I did bare root and spraying several times a day for a little while after that, I think some roots died that way. Now I'm trying moss. I don't know what to do.

It's not really planted in the black pot, it sort of just sits in it. There is moss on the bottom of the pot and I have that little bit wrapped around the roots that you can see in the pictures where it's not in the pot. I basically spray the moss on the roots every other day or so...whenever it's starting to get dry. I also keep the moss at the bottom of the pot moist to help keep some humidity around the roots and keep the moss on the roots from drying out super fast. This way the roots aren't staying wet for long periods of time but they also aren't drying out. I've tried it in bark and it just hates it. When it's been in moss/coir/wet stuff it at least does SOMEthing. But I'm terrified of rotting it so don't feel comfortable completely burying it in moss.


Thanks for the confirmation of the keiki, hopefully it makes it!

[jmmehler]

I believe all orchids go through cycles. There are cycles of plant growth, root development, blooming, etc. Other than the fact that for phals, the blooming cycle may be brought on by a couple of weeks of cooling, I am not aware of any factors that affect the other cycles.

While it may be too late for the mother plant, the keiki, (and mother) would most benefit from a stable environment conducive to growth.

I've noticed that many vendors are now selling phals in larger pots with spaghnum. Without initiating conflict of wether growing in spaghnum is better than other mediums, lets just assume, that a slightly larger pot, packed loosely with spaghnum, can foster a more 'forgiving' environment for struggling phals.

The idea here is to provide maximum air to the roots, and an environment where the moisture is available. Water whenever the spaghnum gets almost completely dry. Mist, or don't mist, or mist every once in awhile, whaterver your choice. Just find some sort of consistency so that the plant can adapt (or die).

In order of importance;
1) Light - As much as possible; Never direct sunlight; Without too much heat.
2) Air flow - Gentle movement to avoid mildew and to help dry up the medium.
3) Water - With good drainage so that the roots can always have air contact.
4) Fertilizer - Weaker than weak (not just weekly weakly), and none for stressed out or dying plants.

[BettyE]

I don't like to grow phals because it is difficult to determine when they need water. It is my belief that more phals ( phalenopsis ) are killed by too much water, rather than enough water. Mine do,however grow & flower for me, and if someone comes over & admires a blooming one, I hand it to them and say "it's yours!" BettyE

[sweetjblue]

Maxy, in 2 years your plant has been thru alot of stress. Potting soil, bark, coir, back to bark, bare root and now moss. Too wet and then too dry.
Since it seems you've had some success using bark (new leaves started and roots) that is what I would go back to. I know I said moss before but that was before your more recent post where you explained the medias you've used.

Make sure you give the bark a good soaking (overnite or a day) and then repot your plant. Don't allow the bark to become dry. A good way to tell if the pot will need to be watered is with either a pencil or skewer inserted in the pot. After 3-4 days pull it out and check to see if its moist or not. If its dry water. If its moist wait another day or two.
Bark will give your plant what it needs at this point, moisture and air. Don't pull the plant from its pot and new medium to check the roots, it needs some stability to be able to establish and get growing.

I would also put it in a slightly shader spot like a East facing window if you have one. At this point your plant cannot really utilize the light like a healthy plant could. Once it begins new roots you can move it back to its normal spot gradually.

Again, good luck in your efforts.

Judi

[campchi]

I started to plant my phal with clay pellet(leca)..and it seems to work just fine as I can water it everyday and not having to worry about over water it since clay pellet dry fast.