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  #1  
Old 06-09-2011, 05:18 AM
alessandro2011 alessandro2011 is offline
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Male
Default Which means "temperature tolerant"?

How many degree on the bottom and on the top out of the "normal" range could be accepted from a specific variety with that label given from the sellers of orchids?
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  #2  
Old 06-09-2011, 06:52 AM
cutebeka cutebeka is offline
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Female
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Im not understanding your wording. But the temps for orchids should be around 60-80 during the day and 45-60 at night for Phals. Each orchid is different with heat and lighting with species. someone can correct me if i'm wrong but that is what I have read everywhere else.
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:30 AM
epiphyte78 epiphyte78 is offline
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Male
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Temperature tolerant = eurythermal. Paul Gripp from the Santa Orchid Barbara Estate (SBOE) can be credited for popularizing the term "temperature tolerant".

Unfortunately, the SBOE is one of very few orchid nurseries that regularly experiments with leaving different species outside. There just doesn't seem to be that much demand for learning exactly what epiphytic orchids are capable of...in terms of temperature or drought tolerance.

Here in Southern California many orchid growers grow most of their orchids in greenhouses. When you visit our local botanical gardens...nearly all the orchids are in greenhouses...yet the trees that the orchids grow on in their native habitat are thriving outside year around and have been doing so for decades.

For example...the LA Arboretum has a large clump of Dendrobium speciosum growing in their greenhouse. Yet in this awesome photo you can see it in its native habitat growing on a Bottle Tree (Brachychiton populneus). If you scroll down that page you can see that the Bottle Tree has been grown in Arizona, California, Nevada and Texas.

Is the Bottle Tree more eurythermal than Dendrobium speciosum? I have no idea. To figure out which orchids to try outside in your area you have to be a real detective and collect as many clues as you can.

Here's an excellent listing of eurythermal bromeliads. All the hardy Fuchsias except the hardiest (Fuchsia magellanica) share habitats with epiphytic orchids. The book Palms Won't Grow Here and Other Myths and other such books are loaded with clues. Also loaded with clues are forums such as Growing on the Edge where people from Europe and other temperate regions document their attempts at growing subtropical and tropical plants outside year around.
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:46 AM
Paul Mc Paul Mc is offline
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Male
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One thing you can do if you have species orchids is find out where they grow in the wild. Once you know where they grow you can search for historical temperatures of that region/place. However, do not look at a countries ranges, for example if your orchid is native to Costa Rica do not look at Costa Rica's temperatures. Your orchid may grow in the mountains where it is cooler than most of Costa Rica. Take where it grows into consideration when searching for temperature information.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:29 AM
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tucker85 tucker85 is offline
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I've seen the term used at least two different ways. Norman's Orchids (Orchids.com) uses the term 'temperature tolerant' when talking about oncidiums, to indicate oncidiums that can tolerate hot weather like we have here in Florida. I've also seen Laelias and Cattleyas described as 'temperature tolerant' when describing their ability to grow outdoors where it may be quite cold at times. I guess you could say the term is used when an orchid can tolerate higher or lower temperatures than other orchids in that same genus.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:42 AM
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Male
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Like Tucker, I have most-often seen the term used to describe a plant that is normally cooler, but can tolerate warmer conditions. When I sell such plants, I rephrase it to "warmth tolerant".

Then there are plants like some of the Chinese cymbidiums that can tolerate snowfall at one end, and highs in the 90's if given enough shade.

I think we should also understand that if you read a description of a "cold-to hot growing" plant, it may not indicate any degree of tolerance at all, but may very well be a case that the plant is found growing in a wide range of conditions. If you move one from one part of the range to another, it may not survive.
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Old 06-09-2011, 09:56 AM
alessandro2011 alessandro2011 is offline
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Male
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epiphyte78 View Post
Temperature tolerant = eurythermal. Paul Gripp from the Santa Orchid Barbara Estate (SBOE) can be credited for popularizing the term "temperature tolerant".
Unfortunately, the SBOE is one of very few orchid nurseries that regularly experiments with leaving different species outside.
Effectively i read this term from that seller.
The problem is that from Australian dendrobium hybrids use this generic term while for other species as Cattleyas and Cymbidiums exist a distinction between Heat tolerant or Cold Tolerant (so from only one extreme of the range).

Quote:
Originally Posted by epiphyte78 View Post
There just doesn't seem to be that much demand for learning exactly what epiphytic orchids are capable of...in terms of temperature or drought tolerance.
I think is a pity for different reasons:
- don't everyone have space for indoor
- a greenhouse isn't something environment friendly given that you should add: light, fan, etc; that require energy

Last edited by alessandro2011; 06-09-2011 at 09:58 AM..
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Old 06-09-2011, 10:24 AM
epiphyte78 epiphyte78 is offline
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alessandro, the talk regarding heat-tolerant Cymbidiums has nothing to do with whether they will survive high temperatures. It has to do with whether they will bloom without a cool/cold winter. A few orchid hybridizers are actively trying to breed for Cymbidiums that will bloom in places like Florida.

Honestly, I can't think of any references of relatively common orchids dying from too much heat outdoors. The SBOE told me I couldn't grow Masdevallias because it gets too hot where I am...but the ones that I've tried have done just fine. The trick is to keep them sufficiently hydrated during the hottest days. During summer I just water them at night with the rest of my orchids and they are fine during the day.

Regarding little demand...yeah, I think it's a pity as well! More people would certainly grow orchids if they realized how tolerant many of them are. It's great when somebody like yourself shows interest in learning about their capabilities.

If any of your local botanical gardens have an orchid collection...you might try approaching them about seeing if they would be open to the possibility of leaving small divisions of some good candidates outside over winter.
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Old 06-09-2011, 11:58 AM
King_of_orchid_growing:) King_of_orchid_growing:) is offline
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Too many people are stuck on myths that have been circulated in the general population for decades. These myths are often times antiquated (old and outdated).

Certain Masdevallias do quite well here in Southern California all year round! These Masdevallias are the same ones that many people/sellers consider to be cool to intermediate. The ones that tend to suffer from our warmest warm are the ones that are found only in elevations above 2,600 m in the Andes. Likewise, no Masdevallias that are found below 1,000 m can handle our coldest cold.

I have many different species of Vandas growing outdoors here in Southern California all year round as well. Many are what are considered to be intermediate to warm growers (some are known to be cool to intermediate growing).

I even grow the supposedly "cool to cold growing" Disas here in temperatures that are obviously much higher than 85 F (29 C).

Different orchids have different temperature tolerances.

There are certain "tricks" to consider when growing orchids outside of their native range. That's up to you to figure out as a grower.

As far as temperature tolerances go, what PaulMc had said about researching not only the country of origin that plant had been recorded to be found in, but the specific region and elevations that they're found in as well, will help you tremendously in figuring out what kinds of temperatures these orchids can handle.

But in specific regards to the temperature tolerance of Den. speciosum...

Den. speciosum is very much like Den. kingianum in temperature tolerance. Both species are able to take it down to 36 F (2 C), and all the way up to 113 F (45 C) easily. These 2 species of Dens grow outdoors here all year round very easily. This is what I would consider "temperature tolerant".

Last edited by King_of_orchid_growing:); 06-10-2011 at 02:01 AM..
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  #10  
Old 06-10-2011, 01:55 AM
alessandro2011 alessandro2011 is offline
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Which means  &quot;temperature tolerant&quot;? Male
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Between these tollerant variety exist someone capable of receiving the direct summer sun, even on the central hours of the day?
For example i read that some variety of Dendrobium can take the direct sun but don't during the central hours.
Is it only a question of humidity?
So if the temperature isn't too extreme is possible? Or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by epiphyte78 View Post
If any of your local botanical gardens have an orchid collection...you might try approaching them about seeing if they would be open to the possibility of leaving small divisions of some good candidates outside over winter.
Unfortunately the situation, from this point of view, is absolutely disastrous because exist few sellers specific for orchids (other seller sell orchids but don't known nothing) and generally they are very small (so the probabilities that make some experiments i think is very low).
For that reasons many italians buy orchids outside Italy (generally Germany).
But given the bad post service the more experienced get the pseudobulbs instead of the plants for reduce the problems associated with transport.
But the big drawbacks with orchids is that them requires years before a plant flower on this way, so it isn't something praticable for newbie.

Last edited by alessandro2011; 06-10-2011 at 02:09 AM..
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