"another" phal in dire need - Orchid Board

aber · #1 06-03-2009, 03:05 AM

Hi everyone, I posted a couple days ago asking "do I have thirps", thanks for the replies! I didn't have them, I had damp soggy moss and root rot! I am slightly confused because the plant looks healthy in all other aspects...no yellow or droopy leaves, no dropped buds, it just had 5 more buds open. However, in reading this forum and the heaps of useful advice I decided to pull it out of its pot and have a look - bad news, rotten roots thru out. I blame the moss...it wasn't drying out fast enough. I was watering very conservatively (1 every 10 days to 2 weeks when the pot felt light) so my conclusion is that moss is not a good medium for orchids on the BC coast.

Anyway, I have the new bark soaking and am going to leave whats left of the roots to dry out tonight, maybe even tomorrow. My question, based on the photos below, is did I trim enough of the roots off? The two longer roots left are still firm, although near the top they have damage and are only connected by the stingy center of the root. Should I trim these off as well? finally, should I cut off the flower spike and let the plant concentrate on recovering?

image 1 - what I found after pulling the orchid out of its pot and moss
image 2 - the roots close up before I trimed
image 3 - what roots I have left to dry out before re potting.

Thanks for your help! R

Blueszz · #2 06-03-2009, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aber

My question, based on the photos below, is did I trim enough of the roots off? The two longer roots left are still firm, although near the top they have damage and are only connected by the stingy center of the root. Should I trim these off as well? finally, should I cut off the flower spike and let the plant concentrate on recovering?

I would leave the two longer roots on the plant. If the velamen (outer layer of the root) is still intact it can absorb water and nutrients. The stringy center is used for transporting the water to the plant. If that string is still intact the root still is functional to the plant. It can help it until it puts out some new roots.

As for the flower spike, I would trim that as low as you can, at least under the lowest node on the stem. Sometimes I don't cut it away as low as I could (in rescues) as that stem could be helpful to give the plant some suport, in case I need a stalk to keep it firm in the new pot. You can attach a short stalk to the old spike to prevent that the plant wiggles in it's new pot, if it has not enough roots to stay upright by itself.

Nicole

camille1585 · #3 06-03-2009, 06:56 AM

I was going to write pretty much what Nicole wrote. But just one thing to add. Since it has so few roots, it would be a good idea to keep it in somewhat high humidity to limit evaporation from the leaves. You don't want the plant to lose more water than it gets from those roots. I have a phal in a similar condition, and I place a large clear plastic bag (like a giant ziploc bag) over it most of the day. Air can still get in and out through the bottom, but it does help keep up the humidity.

RosieC · #4 06-03-2009, 08:39 AM

I agree with what you've been told above.

The good news is that I have a Phal recovering from less roots than that, and while mine is not in a good way, it is still alive after 10 months and it's growing new roots.

When you pot it back up try to ensure it is not 'over-potted'. Really the new pot should be just big enough to hold the roots and not too much bigger. If that is not possible it may be worth packing out the bottom of the pot with something like packing peanuts to reduce the amount of bark, that is what I have done with mine.

Once it is potted back up I advise you water with luke warm water. Mine did not grow new roots until I started doing that. I'm also using KLN in the last couple of months. Difficult to say if it is helping or not, but the Phal is still growing roots.

aber · #5 06-08-2009, 10:30 PM

Thanks everyone for the advice. I have re potted my phal, moved it into a bright (no direct) window, and am keeping my fingers crossed. Ha ha I have to admit I just couldn't make myself cut off the flower spike still in bloom - who knows how long it will be before i get it to bloom again. I thought i would leave it for a bit assuming the blooms would wilt pretty quick...but its been a few days and nothing has happened. What do you guys think...should I cut it off regardless if it wilts or not? I also have been looking for KLN at my local shops...no luck. Any advice on where i can find that (is it available in Canada)? Finally, I was hoping for advice on watering when in bark. To me the bark feels dry almost right away (day or two) but I am only watering once a week. Should I mist the surface of the bark every day?

Thanks so much for the support. Hopefully Ill oneday be able to post photos of this orchid in bloom again after its "rescue". Cheers, R

sunbirdx · #6 06-08-2009, 11:03 PM

Hi!

I am also on the Pacific Coast, in Seattle. I do think moss is a no no here for us, I just think it never gets dry enough. I prefer medium grade bark for my Phals, and it has worked great for the 4 years I have been here. Frankly, I think the PacNW is just a great place for Phals, if you can get the sun right!

My watering regimen is this:
-Mist aerial roots daily, in the AM.
-I soak the pots (yes, soak for 10-20 minutes) once every 7-10 days in a weak fertilizer solution. Make sure there is no standing water in the bottom of the pot!
- I recently started monitoring moisture with bamboo skewers, it is working great! If the skewer feels damp when pressed against your cheek, no need to water!

I use a rooting hormone called "green light" that I picked up at a local hardware store.

orchidsamore · #7 06-08-2009, 11:41 PM

I am a commercial grower of orchids and have to say you did NOT have root rot in the photos you posted. I would not have cut the roots. When Phal roots rot they separate from the plant and would have fallen off when you removed the sphag. Bad roots would have been very black. The brown rots you removed were only older - last years roots.

Fortunately there are plenty of roots for the plant to both keep the flowers and survive.

I do not believe you are watering your plant enough. Phals take great amounts of water and should be soaked heavy when watering.

Here is an old 1950s research article by Cornell University and printed in the American Orchid Society Journal. Look at the photo. The plant grown in water was the biggest with the one watered daily the second biggest.

Remember when reading this that they used osmundo fiber which does not rot like bark will rot. Bark could distort the results.

I grow in sphag with my Phals soaking wet. As a result I can get Phals to flower at only 5 months old. Of 400 plants I potted at one inch size in October 250 flowered starting in February and not a single one rotted.

Frequency of Watering and the Growth of Phalaenopsis

camille1585 · #8 06-09-2009, 04:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aber

Finally, I was hoping for advice on watering when in bark. To me the bark feels dry almost right away (day or two) but I am only watering once a week. Should I mist the surface of the bark every day?

Did you soak the bark prior to repotting? Fresh media does not hold water very well, and soaking bark at least overnight, or even 24 hours, will help a lot. Fresh bark will still dry out much quicker than old bark. If you forgot to soak it before, an alternative is to give the pot a very long soaking at each watering. When I did that, I would leave them an hour.
As for the frequency of watering, using a skewer is a great way to judge the water needs of a plant, as Sunbirdx mentioned. I also water by soaking the pots 15-20 minutes in fertilized water, and I also mist the aerial roots and top of medium every day.

aber · #9 06-09-2009, 10:29 AM

Good morning everyone! Thanks for all the help! I think everyone is right, I have been growing my phals to dry ( I actually have two of them - my rescue and another given to me in rough shape)! As for my rescue I did soak the bark for 24 hours so I think it was a good start. I have also stuck in some bamboo skewers to advice me of when to water. And finally, I have started misting in the AM. I have to admit I am afraid the misting may lead to crown rot - Ill be very careful just to hit the aerial roots and avoid the crown/leaves. I am still going to try and find some KLN in town just to help support the root growth.

sunbirdx · #10 06-09-2009, 11:38 AM

Hi Aber,
By misting the roots and media earlier in the morning, you avoid the crown rot, as there is more time for it to dry out in the warmth of the day, and less time for fungus to grow.