Worm Tea

[Ross]

Originally Posted by IdahoOrchid

Are you saying that fish fertilizer is hype or just the worm stuff?

just saying that science nowadays is much past the old days when fish fertilizer or worm poop was the thing. Just my opinion. We use very organic mixes compounded for specific uses such as orchids grown with RO water.

[boxerfan]

I learned about worm tea on another forum and decided to try it. I get the concentrate from Our Vital Earth. I use it mostly as a folialar spray 4-5 times/week. Since I started with it 6 of 9 Phals have started producing 1-2 new leaves each and my Brassia has put out 3 new spikes. Maybe it's the Worm Tea, maybe not, but something's making these orchids mighty happy. I plan to work with the tea awhile longer. Lisa

[goodgollymissmolly]

It always surprises me how many people are gullible enough to believe in miracles. It starts with bank accounts in Nigeria and lottery wins in Mongolia and beautiful women in Russia. Sadly, gardeners seem especially vulnerable. From bat crap to rotten grass in water to to rotten fish emulsion and now extract of worm crap someone seems to want to believe in miracle cures for their inability to do something well.

Thank goodness some on this forum debunked this new found ripoff.

[IdahoOrchid]

I don't see anyone who claims that guano or worm tea (on this forum) are "miracle cures" for anything. I actually saw one person write about a positive result, disclaimed it and indicated further observation is underway. Sounds pretty reasonable to me.

So, missmolly, you have done a controlled study to prove your skepticism or are you just spouting off and being a belligerant ney-sayer?

[markr]

Originally Posted by goodgollymissmolly

It always surprises me how many people are gullible enough to believe in miracles. It starts with bank accounts in Nigeria and lottery wins in Mongolia and beautiful women in Russia. Sadly, gardeners seem especially vulnerable. From bat crap to rotten grass in water to to rotten fish emulsion and now extract of worm crap someone seems to want to believe in miracle cures for their inability to do something well.

Thank goodness some on this forum debunked this new found ripoff.

You're over-reacting quite a bit. I'm personally skeptical that worm castings/compost (or tea made from it) has anything more to offer orchids than standard chemical fertilizers like Dynagro, etc., but I can assure you that worm compost and fish emulsion are not in any way "Nigerian Bank Account Rip-offs" or "miracle cures" - they are perfectly fine organic sources of N, P, K, and traces, used by farmers all over the world for centuries. I guess one question is, are organic sources of these nutrients more or less effective with epiphytic orchids, especially considering the relatively low population of bacteria (needed to break down complex organic molecules) in orchid media?

[boxerfan]

I may have to choose a less hostile, more open Orchid forum. This is supposed to be fun and educational, getting bashed is neither. Lisa

[gerneveyn]

Please do not make the mistake of judging the whole forum based on her comments. The members here are very friendly and polite with a few exceptions. I would encourage you to visit and post as often as you like and get to know more of the forum's members.

[DasEmpress]

Originally Posted by boxerfan

I may have to choose a less hostile, more open Orchid forum. This is supposed to be fun and educational, getting bashed is neither. Lisa

Please believe us when we say that this is a very friendly board!! Don't let one, ruin the whole!!

[caseydoll]

Lisa, I agree with the last couple posts. I find this forum to be very friendly and can't remember seeing anyone being mean. I think that this is definately an exception. Anyone that has any gardening knowledge knows the benefits of using organic fertilizers such as worm tea, compost, etc. Perhaps to some orchids it is not a complete fertilizer but it surely is a terrific supplement. I think how you use worm tea is a great idea and I personally benefitted from your experience. Please don't let someone like that discourage you from this forum! I really like having a fellow "boxer fan" on here!

Sarah (we're here for ya!)

[goodgollymissmolly]

It amazes me that I am classified as "unfriendly" or "mean" because I challenge the faith based beliefs of some gardening folks. My post actually praised some forum members for questioning the value of "worm tea". The closest I came to any negative meaning was to chastise the entire gardening community (not any individual or group) for their strongly held, and mis-guided beliefs in "natural" miracles. If we accepted everything our ancestors believed we would still be burning witches at the stake and owning slaves.

Let's consider a couple of examples since some folks think I can't "prove" anything. By the way, I believe the burden of proof of efficacy should reside with the person claiming the benefit, not the one questioning the claim.

This does not necessarily apply to orchids but it might. There is a belief that horse, cow, bat, chicken, or other manures are better sources of plant nutrition than synthetic fertilizers. These sources are surely weaker and more variable in nutrients that the majority of synthetics. The synthetics could be made weaker by dilution, but it makes sense to concentrate them for packaging, shipping, and warehousing purposes. That requires the user to be smart enough to follow directions in applying the materials to avoid over application. The natural manures are weak with bat guano being something like 10/4/2 (but not consistent). It is harder to burn (not impossible) with natural materials because they are so weak. Again...the user causes burn, not the product. The nitrogen in natural materials is frequently urea and ammonia, not the nitrate that orchids need since the urea and ammonia must first be broken down by soil microbes to nitrates. Manures (especially horse manure) is a concentration of weed seeds that the animal ate. Would you buy a synthetic that bragged that it contained all manner of weed seeds? I think not!!

The chemical elements and ions needed by plants are present in controlled and reported amounts in the synthetics and plants are completely unaware of the sources of these materials. They don't know or care the source. They just use them as they find them.

Synthetics are essentially free of disease sources. Horse manure is a major souce for tetanus. Lord only knows what bat guano might harbor.

Another example is Milorganite which many gardeners use for fertilizer and some to repell deer. Well, some of you know that Milorganite is dried Milwaukee sewer sludge. The city had a disposal nightmare with mountains of sludge from its sewer treatment plants. Because these sludges contain the concentration of insoluble heavy metals from the entire sewer collection system, they are classified as toxic waste and connot be put into unsecured landfill. Someone in Milwaukee deserves the Nobel Prize for deception by getting permission to spread this waste all over the United States. The lead and arsenic content exceeds anything that a private company would be allowed to dispense. In fact some other group got the government to ban arsenic treated wood because children who eat their playground equipment might be harmed. The arsenic in that wood was way less that in Milorganite. To make matters worse these heavy metals are immobile in clay soil so as you add more and more Milorganite, you build up increasing levels of extremely toxic soil. As for repelling deer. Some cliam the bad ordor does repell deer. Do you want to live an odor that deer avoid? I strongly doubt it works anyway because a hungry deer will eat ANYTHING!

This post is already too long so I won't continue. I might suggest the book "The Truth About Garden Remedies" by Jeff Gilman for a more thorough review of urban garden rumors.

Far from an attack on anyone, I just am trying to question some of your beliefs that have no technical basis in fact. There is nothing wrong with being ignorant, but ignorance by choice is stupidity. If you consider that an attack, then you and I are unlikely to able to communicate.

I might also say that being "friendly" does not include "me to", "good job", or "thanks for sharing" comments. Those may be more apply described as "brown noseing", "slobbering", "drooling", or pollution of the cyberspace. The internet is a wonderful place to exchange ideas and learn new things. Unfortunately, it also serves a social network that would better utilized by sharing information that "Hi yas".

That's my opinion and I 'm sticking to it. Goodgolly here!!